diff --git a/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.html b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.html new file mode 100644 index 0000000000000000000000000000000000000000..08acdbbd846fa3d0cd513a1c94270450c762ed8c --- /dev/null +++ b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.html @@ -0,0 +1,444 @@ + + + + +#mahara-dev Meeting + + + + +

#mahara-dev Meeting

+ +Meeting started by lamiette_ at 19:35:46 UTC +(full logs). + +

+ + + +

Meeting summary

+
    +
  1. Meeting Attendees (lamiette_, 19:35:54) +
      +
    1. dobedobedoh is Andrew Nicols - LUNS Ltd, + UK (dobedobedoh, + 19:36:31)
    2. +
    3. anitsirk is Kristina Hoeppner from Catalyst IT + in Wellington, NZ (anitsirk, + 19:36:36)
    4. +
    5. rkabalin_ is Ruslan Kabalin, LUNS Ltd., + Lancaster, UK (rkabalin_, + 19:36:46)
    6. +
    7. richardm is Richard Mansfield from Catalyst IT + in Wellington, NZ (richardm, + 19:36:52)
    8. +
    9. lamiette_ is Stacey Walker from Catalyst IT in + Brighton UK (lamiette_, + 19:37:02)
    10. +
    11. hughdavenport_ho is Hugh Davenport from + Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ (hughdavenport_ho, + 19:37:06)
    12. +
    13. dan_p_ is Dan Poltawski, LUNS ltd uk (on + train) (dan_p_, + 19:37:24)
    14. +
    15. thomaswbell88 is Thomas Bell from TDM Ltd, + UK (thomaswbell88, + 19:37:28)
    16. +
    17. is Francois Marier (fmarier_, + 19:37:30)
    18. +
    19. bugg_home is Brett Wilkinsa from Catalyst IT in + Wellington, NZ (bugg_home, + 19:37:30)
    20. +
    21. ricardomano is Richard Hand from TDM Ltd, + UK (ricardomano, + 19:37:43)
    22. +
    23. pxh is Piers Harding from Catalyst IT in + Wellington, NZ (pxh, + 19:40:06)
    24. +
    +
  2. +
  3. MNet future -- We're adding Web Services to 1.5 (lamiette_, 19:43:31) +
      +
    1. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices + (fmarier_, + 19:43:43)
    2. +
    3. pxh has writtten a web services framework, + based on the Moodle 2.0 web services Further information at + https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices + (lamiette_, + 19:57:36)
    4. +
    5. pxh> features are: SOAP, REST (really just + basic HTTP post parameters or JSON), and XML-RPC (lamiette_, + 19:59:00)
    6. +
    7. Auth via WSEE for SOAP, as well as the + tokens/users (as mentioned before) (lamiette_, + 19:59:14)
    8. +
    9. https://gitorious.org/mahara-contrib/artefact-webservice + (lamiette_, + 20:02:38)
    10. +
    11. available as a contrib plugin (lamiette_, + 20:02:53)
    12. +
    13. we have to start thinking about Mnet stuff: + largely due to this from Moodle HQ + http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=175158 (lamiette_, + 20:06:14)
    14. +
    +
  4. +
  5. Bug status proposal (lamiette_, 20:06:58) +
      +
    1. milestones have been used for marking bugs to + upcoming releases and as for a changelog/detailed version of the + release notes (lamiette_, + 20:12:12)
    2. +
    3. ACTION: fmarier_ to + update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage + guidelines (lamiette_, + 20:22:45)
    4. +
    5. every new feature on master should have a bug + report associated with it (lamiette_, + 20:25:18)
    6. +
    7. reviewers to be stricter about suitable bug + numbers for features submitted to gerrit - isn't mandatory + though (lamiette_, + 20:32:02)
    8. +
    +
  6. +
  7. MaharaUK2011 (lamiette_, 20:32:31) +
      +
    1. LUNS and TDM have both offered to host + maharauk, so we've suggested that 12 is in Lancaster, hosted by LUNS + and 13 is in the West Midlands, hosted by TDM (lamiette_, + 20:34:58)
    2. +
    3. http://cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/keysigning_party/en/keysigning_party.html + (fmarier_, + 20:40:17)
    4. +
    5. There was also talk about some entity hosting + online 'conferences' inbetween during the year (webinar type + things) (lamiette_, + 20:40:55)
    6. +
    7. twitter hashtag #maharauk11 for anyone + interested in seeing what attendees had to say (lamiette_, + 20:42:20)
    8. +
    9. http://t.co/dFHqjYX - Git in + Mahara (dobedobedoh, + 20:42:39)
    10. +
    11. http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations + - both my presentations (rkabalin_, + 20:43:00)
    12. +
    13. http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations + (lamiette_, + 20:43:29)
    14. +
    15. http://www.slideshare.net/andrewnicols/presentations + for mine (dobedobedoh, + 20:44:10)
    16. +
    17. http://www.slideshare.net/4nitsirk/21-34-ways-to-get-involved-in-mahara + (anitsirk, + 20:44:28)
    18. +
    19. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rbz9vST0CLw + recording (anitsirk, + 20:45:01)
    20. +
    21. Mark Osbornes keynote + http://prezi.com/dubgzzefzioj/maharauk-open-for-learning/ (lamiette_, + 20:45:45)
    22. +
    +
  8. +
  9. Mahara Reviewer applications# (lamiette_, 20:46:05) +
      +
    1. Hugh Davenport Mahara reviewer + application (lamiette_, + 20:48:33)
    2. +
    3. Brett Wilkins Mahara reviewer + application (lamiette_, + 20:48:49)
    4. +
    5. Darryl Hamilton Mahara reviewer + application (lamiette_, + 20:49:26)
    6. +
    7. lordp is Darryl Hamilton (lordp, + 20:49:38)
    8. +
    9. http://meetbot.mahara.org/mahara-dev/2010/mahara-dev.2010-11-10-07.34.html + FYI (dobedobedoh, + 20:51:39)
    10. +
    11. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Code_Review + (lamiette_, + 20:56:30)
    12. +
    13. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Hughdavenport + (lamiette_, + 20:56:40)
    14. +
    15. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Brettwilkins + (fmarier_, + 20:56:54)
    16. +
    17. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Darrylh + (fmarier_, + 20:57:01)
    18. +
    19. AGREED: Hugh + Davenport to become Mahara reviewer (lamiette_, + 21:03:05)
    20. +
    21. AGREED: Brett Wilkins + to become a Mahara reviewer (lamiette_, + 21:09:26)
    22. +
    23. AGREED: (lamiette_, + 21:09:30)
    24. +
    +
  10. +
  11. mahara.org forum badges (lamiette_, 21:13:27) +
      +
    1. AGREED: (lamiette_, + 21:21:05)
    2. +
    3. ACTION: thomaswbell88 + to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post on the wiki + under Specifications in Development (lamiette_, + 21:21:44)
    4. +
    5. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Specifications_in_Development + (lamiette_, + 21:21:52)
    6. +
    +
  12. +
  13. Update on the user manual (lamiette_, 21:24:27) +
      +
    1. the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the + repository contains a Makefile for easy creation of the output + file. (anitsirk, + 21:24:41)
    2. +
    3. the manual sits in git, some information on + where it is and how to set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting + in vim) is at (anitsirk, + 21:24:51)
    4. +
    5. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup + (lamiette_, + 21:24:52)
    6. +
    7. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup + (anitsirk, + 21:24:55)
    8. +
    9. we now have another mahara family member: the + Mahara Scribe thanks to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on + the wiki. :-) (anitsirk, + 21:25:07)
    10. +
    11. the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the + repository contains a Makefile for easy creation of the output + file. (anitsirk, + 21:25:44)
    12. +
    13. the manual sits in git, some information on + where it is and how to set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting + in vim) is at (anitsirk, + 21:25:50)
    14. +
    15. https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup + (anitsirk, + 21:25:56)
    16. +
    17. we now have another mahara family member: the + Mahara Scribe thanks to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on + the wiki. :-) (anitsirk, + 21:26:02)
    18. +
    +
  14. +
  15. Invitation to join the Debian Packaging team (lamiette_, 21:31:00) +
      +
    1. fmarier_ welcomes dobedobedoh and rkabalin_ to + the Mahara packaging team (fmarier_, + 21:35:06)
    2. +
    +
  16. +
  17. Next Meeting date (lamiette_, 21:35:44) +
      +
    1. http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730 + (lamiette_, + 21:39:02)
    2. +
    3. AGREED: (lamiette_, + 21:39:43)
    4. +
    5. http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730 + (lamiette_, + 21:40:18)
    6. +
    7. next meeting Wednesday, 3 August 2011, 07:30:00 + UTC time (lamiette_, + 21:41:44)
    8. +
    +
  18. +
+

+ + + + +Meeting ended at 21:47:27 UTC +(full logs). + +

+ + + +

Action items

+
    +
  1. fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage guidelines
  2. +
  3. thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post on the wiki under Specifications in Development
  4. +
+

+ + + +

Action items, by person

+
    +
  1. fmarier_
      +
    1. fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage guidelines
    2. +
  2. +
  3. thomaswbell88
      +
    1. thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post on the wiki under Specifications in Development
    2. +
  4. +
+

+ + + +

People present (lines said)

+
    +
  1. lamiette_ (186)
  2. +
  3. fmarier_ (120)
  4. +
  5. dobedobedoh (71)
  6. +
  7. anitsirk (61)
  8. +
  9. rkabalin_ (45)
  10. +
  11. pxh (36)
  12. +
  13. dan_p (34)
  14. +
  15. bugg_home (33)
  16. +
  17. richardm (29)
  18. +
  19. thomaswbell88 (26)
  20. +
  21. hughdavenport_ho (19)
  22. +
  23. dan_p_ (11)
  24. +
  25. Mjollnir` (9)
  26. +
  27. lordp (3)
  28. +
  29. waawaamilk (3)
  30. +
  31. maharameet (3)
  32. +
  33. ricardomano (1)
  34. +
+

+ + + +Generated by MeetBot 0.1.4. + diff --git a/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.html b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.html new file mode 100644 index 0000000000000000000000000000000000000000..3540fd2bd79c069a67b2686b67ddc9fdbad2cf81 --- /dev/null +++ b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.html @@ -0,0 +1,717 @@ + + + + +#mahara-dev log + + + + +
19:35:46 <lamiette_> #startmeeting
+19:35:46 <maharameet> Meeting started Wed Jun 29 19:35:46 2011 UTC.  The chair is lamiette_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
+19:35:46 <maharameet> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
+19:35:54 <lamiette_> #topic Meeting Attendees
+19:36:31 <dobedobedoh> #info dobedobedoh is Andrew Nicols - LUNS Ltd, UK
+19:36:36 <anitsirk> #info anitsirk is Kristina Hoeppner from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ
+19:36:46 <rkabalin_> #info rkabalin_ is Ruslan Kabalin, LUNS Ltd., Lancaster, UK
+19:36:52 <richardm> #info richardm is Richard Mansfield from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ
+19:37:02 <lamiette_> #info lamiette_ is Stacey Walker from Catalyst IT in Brighton UK
+19:37:06 <hughdavenport_ho> #info hughdavenport_ho is Hugh Davenport from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ
+19:37:10 <Mjollnir`> anitsirk: what did i do ?
+19:37:22 <Mjollnir`> oh you're doing meetings
+19:37:24 <dan_p_> #info dan_p_ is Dan Poltawski, LUNS ltd uk (on train)
+19:37:28 <thomaswbell88> #info thomaswbell88 is Thomas Bell from TDM Ltd, UK
+19:37:29 * Mjollnir` goes away again
+19:37:30 <fmarier_> #info is Francois Marier
+19:37:30 <bugg_home> #info bugg_home is Brett Wilkinsa from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ
+19:37:39 <bugg_home> Brett Wilkins*
+19:37:43 <ricardomano> #info ricardomano is Richard Hand from TDM Ltd, UK
+19:37:49 <anitsirk> hi Mjollnir`: you were on the train once on your laptop and also walking down the platform with your laptop open so you could attend the first dev meeting :-)
+19:38:50 <Mjollnir`> oh yes
+19:38:54 <Mjollnir`> kevin made a photo
+19:39:04 <lamiette_> right, is that everyone ?
+19:39:12 <dan_p_> Are we doing the . Thing again, for new atendees?
+19:39:20 <anitsirk> pxh was here earlier
+19:39:23 <bugg_home> ?
+19:39:26 <thomaswbell88> ! thing sounds good, what is thing?
+19:40:06 <pxh> #info pxh is Piers Harding from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ
+19:40:31 * pxh will be here for 20 minutes
+19:40:33 <lamiette_> dan_p_: what is the . thing for new attendees?
+19:40:36 <fmarier_> the . (on a single line) is to indicate that you're doing talking
+19:40:48 <fmarier_> so even if you write a multi-line comment
+19:40:59 <fmarier_> like this one, with enters between them
+19:40:59 <anitsirk> pxh: that means we should talk about web services first?
+19:41:12 <lamiette_> anitsirk: I agree
+19:41:14 <fmarier_> then you can still indicate you're done
+19:41:15 <fmarier_> .
+19:41:22 <anitsirk> sorry fmarier_
+19:41:39 <dan_p_> When you finish what you are saying put a . On line when done. So people dont need to wait
+19:41:46 <pxh> anitsirk: can do  - was not sure what people want to know about it ?
+19:41:51 <dan_p_> Argh sorry. Slowtyper
+19:42:42 <dan_p_> pxh: There was. Some interest in web services at mahara uk, would be good to know what you are working on
+19:42:48 <dan_p_> .
+19:42:59 <pxh> .
+19:43:00 <pxh> OK
+19:43:07 <dobedobedoh> #topic MNet future -- We're adding Web Services to 1.5
+19:43:16 <pxh> so the basic are:
+19:43:18 <dobedobedoh> hmm no power;)
+19:43:31 <lamiette_> #topic MNet future -- We're adding Web Services to 1.5
+19:43:33 <pxh> documentation is at https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices
+19:43:43 <fmarier_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices
+19:44:08 <pxh> I farmed it out into an artefact plugin because it is directly derived from Moodle web services in 2.x
+19:45:19 <pxh> it follows the pattern of Moodle Web Services quite closely in terms of authentication via tokens or username/password, and it's use of Zend web services
+19:46:05 <rkabalin_> So, it can potentially replace Mnet feature?
+19:46:06 <pxh> features are:  SOAP, REST (really just basic HTTP post parameters or JSON), and XML-RPC
+19:46:36 <pxh> Auth via WSEE for SOAP, as well as the tokens/users (as mentioned before)
+19:47:13 <pxh> it's plugable - as in it searches for externallib.php, and service.php definition files (like Moodle) at upgrade
+19:47:26 <dan_p_> But Moodle web services are (supposed to be) pluggable, is the same true here
+19:47:37 <pxh> rkabalin_: I would hope that it could quite easily replace mnet if needed
+19:47:41 <dan_p_> Grr, sorry
+19:47:45 * rkabalin_ sorry for interrupting
+19:47:58 <pxh> yes dan_p - it is
+19:48:36 <pxh> more features: has example commandline clients, and I'm just about to commit an interactive web based test client
+19:48:42 <dan_p_> Are there advantages/limitations of making it a plugin itself?
+19:48:47 <pxh> this was for the Ministry of Education NZ
+19:49:08 <pxh> they wanted SOAP, but I wanted the rest (pun intended)
+19:49:29 <fmarier_> pxh: nice one :)
+19:49:41 <anitsirk> lol. you probably need it as well ;-)
+19:49:52 <rkabalin_> It also can be used as API for various remote user/group/institution management tasks
+19:49:58 <dan_p_> Harsh!
+19:50:00 <pxh> from the MoE point of iew the main thing missing is signatures and encryption from WSSE - but nobody uses it
+19:50:11 <pxh> ... but they are a guvament department
+19:50:44 <pxh> yup - rkabalin_ - should have said that - there are 19 functions in the API already
+19:50:56 <rkabalin_> that is cool
+19:51:22 <Mjollnir`> why an artefact plugin and not a new top level plugin type ?
+19:51:24 <pxh> and - to finish - I want to add OAuth as that will open it up properly to 3rd party dev
+19:51:25 <pxh> .
+19:51:28 <Mjollnir`> not that i really have any say :)
+19:51:45 <pxh> Mjollnir`: ignorance probably
+19:51:55 <bugg_home> pxh, can it talk to moodle (2.x) via this API?
+19:52:00 <richardm> Mjollnir`: time constraints, we'll be moving it
+19:52:27 <pxh> Mjollnir`: ... on my part that is
+19:52:55 <Mjollnir`> is it really less work to make it an artefact plugin and have to implement contracts that you don't need than make a new top level plugin ? eh, maybe i dunno
+19:52:59 <Mjollnir`> :)
+19:53:19 * dan_p_ alighting train, connectivity unknown
+19:53:24 <pxh> bugg_home: I haven't had time to test this yet - one of the things I wanted to do was to try and get it talking over the Moodle hub (in a limited way) but I'm still trying to deliver the original requirement to the MoE
+19:54:27 <pxh> .. as they are paying for it at the moment
+19:54:29 <lamiette_> pxh: so it's derived from Moodle 2.x but tested/written to work with 1.9 only at this stage?
+19:56:14 <pxh> lamiette_: I haven't got as far as integration testing  etc. with Moodle yet - once I get the MoE requirement behind me - I can look at making this useful to the wider Mahara community
+19:56:25 <lamiette_> awesome
+19:57:13 <dobedobedoh> pxh: Sounds good
+19:57:18 <rkabalin_> yeah, that sounds great
+19:57:21 <pxh> but anyway - useful things would be OAuth, and  MNet replacement
+19:57:23 <dobedobedoh> Look forward to reviewing on gerrit for master ;)
+19:57:36 <lamiette_> #info pxh has writtten a web services framework, based on the Moodle 2.0 web services Further information at https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices
+19:57:46 <lamiette_> (sorry guys, i'm a bit slow on this chairing thing!)
+19:58:01 <anitsirk> the first lms to integrate it with is not moodle to ensure that the api also works with others as mahara and moodle are closer to each other than mahara and another system
+19:58:02 <rkabalin_> so with one feature we can potentially resolve two issues: Mnet and API
+19:59:00 <lamiette_> #info pxh> features are:  SOAP, REST (really just basic HTTP post parameters or JSON), and XML-RPC
+19:59:14 <lamiette_> #info Auth via WSEE for SOAP, as well as the tokens/users (as mentioned before)
+19:59:23 <dobedobedoh> pxh: When do you expect to submit this, and are you hoping to have it in 1.5?
+20:00:38 <lamiette_> any more questions for pxh ?
+20:00:41 <pxh> dobedobedoh: it needs work on cleaning the code base out - removing unnecessary cruft from the Moodle base - then it needs some fairly critical review
+20:00:46 * rkabalin_ thinks it is already in contrib
+20:01:19 <pxh> rkabalin_ yup - in contrib
+20:01:28 <pxh> .. but not in core
+20:01:34 <dobedobedoh> Cool. Hadn't seen it
+20:01:47 * dobedobedoh has no further questions
+20:01:58 <pxh> .. if it were to go in core then it would be moved out of being an artefact plugin
+20:02:08 <lamiette_> righto, we're half an hour through and pxh said he had to move on at 20minutes
+20:02:26 <pxh> plugin is at https://gitorious.org/mahara-contrib/artefact-webservice
+20:02:38 <lamiette_> #link https://gitorious.org/mahara-contrib/artefact-webservice
+20:02:53 <lamiette_> #info available as a contrib plugin
+20:02:53 <pxh> lamiette_: thought I was on duty to take kids to school - but Marysia is doing it
+20:03:07 <lamiette_> lucky :)
+20:03:31 <lamiette_> rkabalin_: did you want to talk about the future of MNET while we're on a similar topic?
+20:03:39 <lamiette_> or was that just a lead in to pxh web service?
+20:04:30 <rkabalin_> Yep, a sort of, I was just going to rise the issue and notify that we have to start thinking about Mnet stuff
+20:04:58 <lamiette_> I shall topic it and you can have the stage
+20:05:12 <rkabalin_> not really needed
+20:05:20 <lamiette_> okay ...
+20:05:21 <rkabalin_> since we covered it in this discussion
+20:05:38 <rkabalin_> ..
+20:05:38 <lamiette_> I'm going to info something though :P
+20:06:14 <lamiette_> #info we have to start thinking about Mnet stuff: largely due to this from Moodle HQ http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=175158
+20:06:25 <lamiette_> right, is that all for MNET and web services?
+20:06:37 <pxh> that's all from me
+20:06:44 <rkabalin_> yep
+20:06:58 <lamiette_> #topic Bug status proposal
+20:07:05 <lamiette_> fmarier_: this one was yours
+20:07:49 <fmarier_> ok, so let me start with the milestone thing
+20:08:08 <fmarier_> so far, we've used milestones on the tracker for two things
+20:08:31 <fmarier_> 1- as a bit of a TODO list for the upcoming release (that is, bugs that have a milestone but aren't done yet)
+20:09:06 <fmarier_> 2- as a changelog or a detailed version of the release notes (once the release is done and the bugs are fixed)
+20:09:26 <fmarier_> to make this more useful for #2, I'd like to propose the following
+20:10:02 <fmarier_> we omit from the milestone bugs that don't apply to the stable releases
+20:10:24 <fmarier_> so for example, if you add a new feature (say sitemaps) and they have a bug,
+20:10:49 <fmarier_> then the fixup bug doesn't retain the 1.5 milestone when it's fixed
+20:11:41 <fmarier_> the original feature bug goes onto the 1.5 milestone of course because it's one of the relevant changes from the stable branches, but the bug that got fixed in it isn't very relevant to people upgrading from 1.4
+20:12:12 <lamiette_> #info milestones have been used for marking bugs to upcoming releases and as for a changelog/detailed version of the release notes
+20:12:15 <fmarier_> in that case, you'd just mark the bug as "fix released" without a milestone
+20:12:15 <lamiette_> fmarier_: makes sense to me
+20:12:31 <fmarier_> because when you use "fix committed", you must specify a milestone
+20:12:42 <dobedobedoh> So the milestone is more for bugs fixed since the last release, rather than aimed for the next
+20:12:55 <fmarier_> otherwise the bug gets into that state and isn't listed anywhere so nobody remembers to flick it to fix released once 1.5 is out :)
+20:13:03 <fmarier_> dobedobedoh: it's for both
+20:13:27 <dobedobedoh> Ah I see
+20:13:28 <fmarier_> but once a bug is fixed, you can remove the milestone if it doesn't make sense to have it stick around
+20:13:30 <lamiette_> #info suggestion: for better changelog only mark main feature bugs with the milestone and any follow up fixes to that feature just as "fix committed" ommiting the milestone
+20:13:47 <fmarier_> lamiette_: that's slightly wrong
+20:13:50 <lamiette_> oh
+20:13:55 <lamiette_> I misunderstood then sorry
+20:14:03 <fmarier_> we mark ALL new features against the milestone
+20:14:10 <fmarier_> and all bug fixes that apply to 1.4
+20:14:12 <lamiette_> #undo
+20:14:12 <maharameet> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x876ab4c>
+20:14:22 <fmarier_> it's the bugs that only affect master that don't need to go on there
+20:14:35 <fmarier_> for example, we broke the creation of new institutions recently
+20:14:51 <fmarier_> but that doesn't need to be in our release notes, because we've never release a version of mahara with that bug
+20:15:12 <fmarier_> so we would mark it as "fix release" with no milestone once it's been merged
+20:15:13 <fmarier_> .
+20:15:25 <rkabalin_> I see fmarier_
+20:16:31 <rkabalin_> so basically all new features and previous relese fixes are marked with milestone
+20:16:31 <fmarier_> so anyways, i want to run it past all of you to see if you have any objections
+20:17:15 <fmarier_> richardm brought something up: if you change a new feature in a significant way, then that should probably also have the milestone set so that it's visible
+20:17:45 <lamiette_> fmarier_: yup
+20:17:49 <fmarier_> but if you're just fixing it so that it does what it was supposed to do in the first place when you merged it on master, then it's probably not worth it
+20:17:55 <fmarier_> .
+20:18:10 <fmarier_> rkabalin_: yes
+20:18:11 <richardm> i'd also suggest we could take care of thta case by repoening the feature bug
+20:18:30 <fmarier_> richardm: true
+20:19:05 <lamiette_> richardm: so in the case (using something I know) of dropdowns we could open the existing feature bug again for the inst membership navigation move to Groups yeah?
+20:19:22 <richardm> lamiette_: yeah, that's a good idea
+20:19:25 <lamiette_> sweet
+20:19:28 <fmarier_> sounds good
+20:19:47 <richardm> sometimes if it's a regression we don't know what feature caused it though :(
+20:20:14 <lamiette_> richardm: I suppose this only works for things we know then, but that'd at least take care of a fair amount
+20:20:33 <fmarier_> richardm: if you know it's only on master, then you don't need the milestone
+20:21:16 <lamiette_> so everyone understand/ in agreement?
+20:21:29 <fmarier_> what i'm suggesting is a guideline, we can see how it goes and adjust if anything we haven't thought about pops up
+20:21:34 <lamiette_> fmarier_: will you document this? :)
+20:21:49 <fmarier_> yes, i'll update the bug status page if everybody agrees
+20:21:59 <rkabalin_> I like reopening idea, we will have less bugs then and it will be easier to follow all the stuff related to the particular featute
+20:22:09 <rkabalin_> I agree
+20:22:45 <lamiette_> #action fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage guidelines
+20:23:08 <rkabalin_> less issues on the tracker I mean
+20:23:12 <lamiette_> fmarier_: you had a couple more points in that list?
+20:23:24 <fmarier_> the other minor point i had in there was that all new features added to master should have a bug on the tracker
+20:23:35 <fmarier_> that will help heaps when we write the release notes for 1.5 :)
+20:23:36 <dobedobedoh> agreed
+20:23:51 <lamiette_> yup, agreed
+20:23:53 <rkabalin_> makes sense
+20:24:01 <dobedobedoh> I was also going to suggest that we add a Makefile target to check that they're also specified in the commit message
+20:24:07 <richardm> agree (even though i'm a serial offender)
+20:24:09 <dobedobedoh> In a specific format
+20:24:19 <lamiette_> dobedobedoh: that's on fmarier_ 's list :)
+20:24:24 * dobedobedoh added it there ;)
+20:24:31 <lamiette_> ohhhhh I seee
+20:24:38 <fmarier_> dobedobedoh: that would however imply that every commit needs a bug number, right?
+20:24:47 <fmarier_> which we haven't enforced so far
+20:24:52 <dobedobedoh> Correct
+20:25:00 <dobedobedoh> I thought that the two would go pretty much hand-in-hand
+20:25:04 <fmarier_> do people want that?
+20:25:18 <lamiette_> #info every new feature on master should have a bug report associated with it
+20:25:25 <fmarier_> i personnally can see that for some small commits, it's a bit overkill
+20:25:29 <fmarier_> (like a typo fix)
+20:25:35 <hughdavenport_ho> sortof makes sense
+20:25:45 <richardm> I'm less keen on forcing bug numbers for every commit
+20:25:50 <dobedobedoh> I think it would really help with the changelogs -- as I understand (and correct me if I'm wrong), it would automatically fill the changelog -- https://launchpad.net/mahara/1.4/1.4.0 under "View the full changelog"
+20:25:50 <bugg_home> it'd be a good rule of thumb, but not something to actively enforce
+20:25:58 <dobedobedoh> Fair enough
+20:26:04 <hughdavenport_ho> small fixes can just be tagged to a default bug of say "Fix typos" etc
+20:26:17 <richardm> dobedobedoh: i thnk it's the milestones that fill the changelog
+20:26:24 <fmarier_> yeah perhaps it should be actively requested by reviewers
+20:26:35 <fmarier_> except for trivial cases
+20:26:51 <lamiette_> fmarier_: if we do that we could see how often bug numbers are requested and used
+20:26:54 <hughdavenport_ho> we could put it in the minaccept check, and then discard it if it's trivial
+20:26:55 <dobedobedoh> Perhaps that's a better solution -- reviewers requesting it
+20:27:00 <lamiette_> and if it's then worth making it an enforcement etc
+20:27:23 <dobedobedoh> Or, if it is trivial, using something like (minorbug) instead of (bug #xyz)
+20:27:24 <dobedobedoh> but better
+20:27:24 <dobedobedoh> .
+20:27:59 <rkabalin_> dobedobedoh: yeah, I like minorbug idea
+20:28:06 <fmarier_> to me, it seems similar to: -1, your commit message doesn't really explain what you did
+20:28:22 <fmarier_> it's a subjective thing that relies on the reviewer's good judgment
+20:28:52 <richardm> I think it's also overkill when you have a series of commits for 1 feature
+20:28:53 <bugg_home> I'm happy to leave it up to the reviewer
+20:29:04 <richardm> it doesn't always make sense to use the same bug number
+20:29:17 <richardm> (but maybe you need to create another bug at that point)
+20:29:28 <bugg_home> richardm: agreed.
+20:29:57 <lamiette_> right, lets move on yeah?
+20:30:26 <dobedobedoh> I don't mind either way, but I think that we should be actively trying to encourage use of bug #s so reviewers demanding works for me :)
+20:30:27 <fmarier_> do we have agreement on being stricter about forgotten bug numbers without making it mandatory?
+20:30:43 <richardm> yes, agree
+20:30:46 <fmarier_> (mandatory for new features though)
+20:30:49 <dobedobedoh> yup
+20:31:00 <rkabalin_> agree
+20:31:03 <lamiette_> yup
+20:31:10 <hughdavenport_ho> yes
+20:31:14 <bugg_home> yes
+20:32:02 <lamiette_> #info reviewers to be stricter about suitable bug numbers for features submitted to gerrit - isn't mandatory though
+20:32:26 <lamiette_> right, a quick topic now:
+20:32:31 <lamiette_> #topic MaharaUK2011
+20:32:40 <lamiette_> seeing as this just happened
+20:33:00 <lamiette_> i wanted to bring it to attention in case anyone had anything interesting to say about it
+20:33:48 <lamiette_> one rumor i've heard from it is that we're going to have a northern UK maharauk12 ;)
+20:34:02 <dobedobedoh> That's the plan
+20:34:29 <dobedobedoh> LUNS and TDM have both offered to host maharauk, so we've suggested that 12 is in Lancaster, hosted by LUNS
+20:34:35 <dobedobedoh> and 13 is in the West Midlands, hosted by TDM
+20:34:46 <thomaswbell88> I don't think its a underground secret, but it's planned  ... as above :P
+20:34:58 <lamiette_> #info LUNS and TDM have both offered to host maharauk, so we've suggested that 12 is in Lancaster, hosted by LUNS and 13 is in the West Midlands, hosted by TDM
+20:35:06 <dobedobedoh> We're waiting for feedback from the governance group as far as I understand
+20:35:18 <lamiette_> sweet
+20:35:24 <anitsirk> sam told me that meredith and roger are writing the conference report. lamiette_ do you have any idea if there is a 100 words or so in it for the newsletter (out tomorrow) or shall i just write that it happened at that the report will be on the web site soon?
+20:35:28 <anitsirk> .
+20:35:30 <lamiette_> other things were:
+20:35:39 <lamiette_> great interest in skins from lots of people
+20:35:51 <thomaswbell88> There was also talk about some entity hosting online 'conferences' inbetween during the year
+20:35:58 <thomaswbell88> .
+20:36:20 <bugg_home> thomaswbell88: webinar type things?
+20:36:33 <lamiette_> and anitsirk's what was it 22.5 million ways to get involved (?) being quite a popular discussion
+20:37:01 <thomaswbell88> yep, it was asked as a question by a delegate and followed up with a few, mmm's and arrr's
+20:37:30 <lamiette_> anitsirk: not sure, but I can check with them tomorrow morning
+20:37:33 * dobedobedoh has a list of feature ideas that he thought up during the conference to add to the tracker
+20:37:40 <lamiette_> anitsirk: newsletter for tomorrow NZ time yeah?
+20:38:08 * lamiette_ and paul did the navigation dropdown thing while at the conference
+20:38:12 <anitsirk> haven't heard back from meredith yet. yep, NZ time. so your tomorrow morning would still be fine if the text comes through with it. just 100-150 words though please. that's enough.
+20:38:18 <lamiette_> inspired by thomaswbell88's page editing JS
+20:38:37 <lamiette_> anitsirk: I'll chase it up
+20:39:02 <lamiette_> oh, fmarier_ : we had the keysigning party
+20:39:02 <anitsirk> thank you. otherwise i'll just mention it and refer to the web site
+20:39:04 <lamiette_> there was no cake
+20:39:12 <anitsirk> huh?
+20:39:25 <dobedobedoh> The key signing party consisted of lamiette, rkabalin, and myselft
+20:39:32 <lamiette_> it was rocking!
+20:39:37 <anitsirk> what is a key signing party?
+20:39:42 <fmarier_> cool, we'll have a stronger trust path between NZ and the UK now :)
+20:39:53 <dobedobedoh> Indeed :)
+20:39:59 <anitsirk> oh the gpg key?
+20:40:02 <fmarier_> anitsirk: signing each other's gpg keys
+20:40:02 <lamiette_> anitsirk: signing gpg keys, so we know to trust each other
+20:40:06 <thomaswbell88> they are real people now, not I I'm afraid
+20:40:17 <fmarier_> #link http://cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/keysigning_party/en/keysigning_party.html
+20:40:21 <fmarier_> for the gory details
+20:40:30 <dobedobedoh> thomaswbell88: We'll get you gitted and gpg'd up soon Im' sure ;)
+20:40:55 <lamiette_> #info There was also talk about some entity hosting online 'conferences' inbetween during the year (webinar type things)
+20:41:02 <dobedobedoh> rkabalin did a presentation on gerrit, and I did a tour of git to get people more interested in developing features
+20:41:23 <dobedobedoh> slides are available online
+20:41:28 <lamiette_> emphasis was definitely on contributing to mahara this year
+20:41:34 <dobedobedoh> Definately
+20:41:37 <lamiette_> oh slide links everyone ?
+20:42:20 <lamiette_> #info twitter hashtag #maharauk11 for anyone interested in seeing what attendees had to say
+20:42:39 <dobedobedoh> #link http://t.co/dFHqjYX - Git in Mahara
+20:43:00 <rkabalin_> http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations - both my presentations
+20:43:28 <thomaswbell88> I fumbled through a 'non-presentation' (no slides) on the dev day
+20:43:29 <lamiette_> #link http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations
+20:44:10 <dobedobedoh> #link http://www.slideshare.net/andrewnicols/presentations for mine
+20:44:25 <anitsirk> ok. if everybody posts their presentation links, here's the 21 3/4 ways to get involved in mahara (recording is so far only on youtube)
+20:44:26 <fmarier_> rkabalin_: i really liked your gerrit presentation
+20:44:28 <anitsirk> #link http://www.slideshare.net/4nitsirk/21-34-ways-to-get-involved-in-mahara
+20:44:44 <dobedobedoh> If anyone is interested in more info on the isolated institutions feature, rkabalin also presented on that
+20:44:44 <fmarier_> well, the slide contents at least, i wasn't there to see the live thing ;-)
+20:44:47 <rkabalin_> fmarier_: thanks
+20:44:48 <lamiette_> thomaswbell88's tools panel http://yfrog.com/gzbkqiej
+20:45:01 <anitsirk> #link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rbz9vST0CLw recording
+20:45:15 * dobedobedoh thinks that's all he has to say about maharauk11
+20:45:45 <lamiette_> #link Mark Osbornes keynote http://prezi.com/dubgzzefzioj/maharauk-open-for-learning/
+20:45:48 <lamiette_> yup
+20:45:50 <lamiette_> lets move on
+20:46:05 <lamiette_> #topic Mahara Reviewer applications#
+20:46:12 <lamiette_> we have three:
+20:46:17 <lamiette_> hughdavenport_ho:
+20:46:20 <lamiette_> bugg_home:
+20:46:24 <lamiette_> and lordp
+20:46:28 <rkabalin_> wait
+20:46:35 <lamiette_> ?
+20:46:48 <rkabalin_> I was going to mention thomaswbell88's idea
+20:47:00 <rkabalin_> about badges on the forum
+20:47:18 <anitsirk> shall we just do it after the applications?
+20:47:18 <rkabalin_> (see 3.2 on agenda)
+20:47:23 <rkabalin_> ok
+20:47:38 <lamiette_> oh right, sorry rkabalin_
+20:47:57 <anitsirk> applicants, please step forward. lorp should be here now as well.
+20:48:16 <hughdavenport_ho> hello
+20:48:22 <bugg_home> hi all
+20:48:33 <lamiette_> #info Hugh Davenport Mahara reviewer application
+20:48:49 <lamiette_> #info Brett Wilkins Mahara reviewer application
+20:49:09 <fmarier_> so who is a current reviewer (and online) at the moment?
+20:49:14 * fmarier_ is a reviewer
+20:49:21 * dobedobedoh is a reviewer
+20:49:26 <lamiette_> #info Darryl Hamilton Mahara reviewer application
+20:49:32 <lamiette_> I think I am
+20:49:38 <lordp> #info lordp is Darryl Hamilton
+20:49:46 * rkabalin_ is reviewer
+20:49:49 * richardm is a reviewer
+20:50:03 <dobedobedoh> lamiette_: yup you are
+20:50:12 <dobedobedoh> Just missing dan_p who'se probably lost packets
+20:50:17 <fmarier_> so we've got five?
+20:50:24 <dobedobedoh> 5 out of 6
+20:50:26 <lamiette_> is five what we need?
+20:50:38 * lamiette_ forgets how many we need
+20:50:48 <fmarier_> we haven't really set a quorum, this is the first time we do this :)
+20:51:01 <fmarier_> but if we had only 1, it would be a bit dodgy
+20:51:07 <lamiette_> right, let the games begin then!
+20:51:07 <fmarier_> 5 is plenty i'd say
+20:51:11 <dobedobedoh> consensus decision rules, with those at the meeting entitled to vote
+20:51:33 <lamiette_> first up: hughdavenport_ho
+20:51:35 * dan_p is back
+20:51:37 <hughdavenport_ho> hello
+20:51:38 <fmarier_> dobedobedoh: those _reviewers_ at the meeting :)
+20:51:39 <dobedobedoh> http://meetbot.mahara.org/mahara-dev/2010/mahara-dev.2010-11-10-07.34.html FYI
+20:51:52 <dobedobedoh> sorry yes, only reviewers
+20:52:13 <lamiette_> hmm, I haven't been doing "agrees" oops
+20:52:42 <lamiette_> anyway - vote?
+20:53:06 <lamiette_> and who is sponsoring
+20:53:11 <lamiette_> fmarier_: are you for all three?
+20:53:15 <fmarier_> any questions for hughdavenport_ho ?
+20:53:18 <hughdavenport_ho> some info on what I have done https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Hughdavenport
+20:54:03 <hughdavenport_ho> .
+20:54:44 <fmarier_> btw, the "becoming a reviewer" process has been documented here: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Code_Review
+20:55:14 <fmarier_> (slightly modified version from the meeting log above given that we no longer have committers)
+20:56:18 <fmarier_> do people need more time to read hughdavenport_ho bugg_home and lordp 's pages?
+20:56:30 <lamiette_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Code_Review
+20:56:40 <lamiette_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Hughdavenport
+20:56:54 <fmarier_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Brettwilkins
+20:57:00 * dobedobedoh is ready to vote
+20:57:01 <fmarier_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Darrylh
+20:57:39 * fmarier_ is ready as well
+20:57:47 * rkabalin_ ready to vote, in fact read through their reports prior the meeting
+20:57:53 <dobedobedoh> ditto
+20:57:59 <richardm> yep, me too
+20:58:12 <dan_p> ready to vote!!
+20:58:25 <fmarier_> dan_p: awesome we have a full house :)
+20:58:34 <fmarier_> lamiette_: ready?
+20:58:40 <lamiette_> yup
+20:59:02 * fmarier_ moves to accept hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer
+20:59:19 * rkabalin_ accepts hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer
+20:59:20 * dobedobedoh moves to accept hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer
+20:59:36 * richardm accepts hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer
+20:59:42 * dan_p accepts hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer
+20:59:54 * lamiette_ moves to accept hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer
+21:00:18 <lordp> fire alarm at catalyst
+21:00:23 <anitsirk> fireall at catalystback in a minute or later
+21:00:28 <dan_p> lol
+21:00:30 <lamiette_> typical
+21:00:31 <fmarier_> nice :)
+21:00:31 <hughdavenport_ho> :P
+21:00:35 <bugg_home> lol
+21:00:37 <lamiette_> lets talk about them while they're gone
+21:00:40 <fmarier_> we were overdue for a firedrill
+21:00:43 <dan_p> best timimg
+21:00:50 * fmarier_ is supposed to be the fire warden
+21:00:56 <hughdavenport_ho> heh
+21:01:03 * bugg_home is supposed to be fmarier_'s backup
+21:01:08 <richardm> we can still vote without them, all the reviewers are still here
+21:01:09 <bugg_home> xD
+21:01:12 <hughdavenport_ho> double heh
+21:01:24 <lamiette_> k, anyway
+21:01:24 <fmarier_> who's not here? just anitsirk ?
+21:01:28 <lamiette_> was that all of us?
+21:01:29 <bugg_home> fmarier_: peterb won't even be at work yet
+21:01:37 <bugg_home> fmarier_: anitsirk and lordp
+21:01:45 <fmarier_> ok, let's vote on bugg_home then
+21:02:48 <bugg_home> lamiette_: that was all of you
+21:03:04 <lamiette_> cool
+21:03:05 <fmarier_> any questions for bugg_home?
+21:03:05 <lamiette_> #agreed Hugh Davenport to become Mahara reviewer
+21:04:09 <lamiette_> none from me
+21:04:20 <dan_p> I was at a wedding this weekend, the mahara-dev proces feels strangely familiar ;-)
+21:04:32 <fmarier_> dan_p: lol
+21:04:47 <lamiette_> who's kissing the bride then?
+21:04:51 <waawaamilk> hah, those catalyst folk, what lols
+21:04:53 * fmarier_ bags not
+21:04:56 <hughdavenport_ho> uhhh...
+21:04:57 <bugg_home> who's the bride?
+21:04:58 <waawaamilk> ooh shit
+21:05:01 <waawaamilk> they're back :p
+21:05:08 * hughdavenport_ho thinks i should leave now...
+21:05:42 <lamiette_> moving on
+21:06:19 * lamiette_ moves to accept bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer
+21:06:28 * dobedobedoh accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer
+21:06:53 <fmarier_> #agree
+21:06:55 * richardm accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer
+21:07:06 * rkabalin_ accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer
+21:07:17 * dan_p accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer
+21:07:31 <richardm> arise, sir bugg_home
+21:08:09 <bugg_home> richardm: I'll try to not be sick and make it into work today ;)
+21:08:22 <richardm> arise, sir bugg
+21:08:44 * dan_p wonders if we can sneak any extra mahara-dev vows
+21:08:45 <fmarier_> right, so time for lordp
+21:09:12 * dobedobedoh accepts lordp as a Mahara reviewer
+21:09:23 <fmarier_> #agree
+21:09:26 <lamiette_> #agreed Brett Wilkins to become a Mahara reviewer
+21:09:28 * rkabalin_ accepts lordp as a Mahara reviewer
+21:09:29 * richardm accepts lordp as a Mahara reviewer
+21:09:30 <lamiette_> #agree
+21:09:38 <lamiette_> fmarier_: can I action these to you?
+21:09:43 <anitsirk> catalystas are coming back now
+21:09:44 <dobedobedoh> they're already done!
+21:09:49 <lamiette_> dobedobedoh: oh really?
+21:09:56 * dobedobedoh has had two e-mails so far
+21:09:57 <lamiette_> cool
+21:10:05 * lamiette_ has ridiculously slow emial
+21:10:07 <lamiette_> *email
+21:10:08 <lamiette_> right
+21:10:29 <lamiette_> that's all the applications so lets get back to rkabalin_ and thomaswbell88 forum badge thingamees
+21:10:37 <fmarier_> is dan_p still here?
+21:10:43 <dan_p> yep
+21:10:49 <fmarier_> dd you vote on lordp ?
+21:10:50 <anitsirk> fmarier: worst time ever for a fire drill as neither our fir wardens from level 6 were there. ;-)
+21:11:00 <anitsirk> fir = fire
+21:11:01 * dan_p accepts lordp as a Mahara reviwer
+21:11:05 <bugg_home> anitsirk: and I, their backup, was not either
+21:11:24 <fmarier_> anitsirk: yeah l6 is going to fail this one :)
+21:11:26 <anitsirk> nope. i cleared l6 on behalf of you guys so that we could get back in
+21:11:38 <lamiette_> *ahem* it's just gone 10pm over here ...
+21:11:41 <lamiette_> :)
+21:11:42 <fmarier_> we usually pass the afternoon ones though :)
+21:11:49 <anitsirk> with flying colors
+21:11:59 <anitsirk> ok. lordp is back as well.
+21:12:19 <bugg_home> rkabalin_ and thomaswbell88's forum badges!
+21:12:26 <bugg_home> :P
+21:12:27 <rkabalin_> right
+21:12:27 <fmarier_> lordp: please add your catalyst email address on launchpad
+21:13:05 <rkabalin_> since thomaswbell88 is here, he might tell us about his idea himself
+21:13:10 <thomaswbell88> sure
+21:13:12 <lamiette_> unless he's fallen asleep ..
+21:13:13 <rkabalin_> ;)
+21:13:15 <thomaswbell88> zzz
+21:13:16 <dobedobedoh> topic change?
+21:13:27 <lamiette_> #topic mahara.org forum badges
+21:13:31 <lamiette_> there
+21:13:34 <dobedobedoh> :p
+21:13:43 <lamiette_> thomaswbell88: go for it
+21:14:16 <thomaswbell88> forum badges are used in many community forums to engage members.. examples for me are Ubuntu community
+21:14:27 <thomaswbell88> i'm sure you've all seen them around?
+21:14:39 <thomaswbell88> Most of you would have a Core Developer 'badge'
+21:14:59 <thomaswbell88> or Code Reviewer for those privelaged
+21:15:01 <fmarier_> we've already got lots of cool icons we can use for these badges :)
+21:15:04 <thomaswbell88> ;P
+21:15:10 <dobedobedoh> We'd probably have to modify the forum code
+21:15:12 <anitsirk> yep. sounds good
+21:15:14 * rkabalin_ Moodle forum is another example
+21:15:15 <lordp> fmarier_: done
+21:15:19 <dobedobedoh> Sounds good to me
+21:15:34 <bugg_home> that sounds like a cool idea
+21:15:37 <thomaswbell88> I thought it might engage more people to get involved in the contribution, which is certainly an issue i think?
+21:15:45 * lamiette_ likes more pretty pictures
+21:15:48 <fmarier_> thomaswbell88: do you want to start a wiki page with the list of badges you thought about?
+21:16:07 <thomaswbell88> sure
+21:16:12 <fmarier_> it could go on here: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Specifications_in_Development
+21:16:32 <fmarier_> since it will be a new Mahara feature for mahara.org (but could be in core as well)
+21:16:56 <rkabalin_> another good thing that you also know who replied to you on the forum - core developer, translator, contributior or just an ordinary user
+21:17:06 <lamiette_> rkabalin_: yeah
+21:17:11 <thomaswbell88> absolutely rkabalin
+21:17:11 <richardm> yeah i vote for in core
+21:17:16 <fmarier_> it would be good also to flesh out how people earn badges, who gives them, how, etc.
+21:17:26 <bugg_home> fmarier_: we'd want to have institution-definable badges, in that case?
+21:17:44 <fmarier_> bugg_home: maybe, but we could start with site-wide ones
+21:17:48 <richardm> group admin might be better, seeing as the forums are all in groups
+21:17:57 <bugg_home> ah
+21:18:02 <richardm> like moderators
+21:18:04 <anitsirk> i think it would also be good to see other forum posts from the same author more easily. the google search is ehm not really good. the dates and post info is all wrong for most things
+21:18:13 <dan_p> have you guys seen teh particularl helpful moodlers group in moodle?
+21:18:22 <fmarier_> if it's too complicated or too much work, then it's less likely it will happen
+21:18:24 <rkabalin_> or it could be just a user reputation setting - we can just assign them
+21:18:27 <lamiette_> fmarier_: could be like requested group membership or something - reviewers group, contrib plugins group, security group etc yeah
+21:18:34 <fmarier_> dan_p: yeah that's a pretty good one
+21:18:42 <bugg_home> would it be cool if the badges could be site-wide? that way when you place feedback on a pagge then your badges can show up there too
+21:18:42 <anitsirk> groups are not associated with institutions, bugg_home
+21:18:54 <dan_p> phm is algorithimically driven atm
+21:19:59 <dan_p> "These people have written a lot of "useful" posts in the Using Moodle forums recently, as determined by the Moodle community when they rate posts.
+21:20:02 <dan_p> The formula is currently:
+21:20:05 <dan_p> Must have posted something in the past 60 days
+21:20:07 <dan_p> Must have been rated "Useful" 14 or more times, by more than 8 raters
+21:20:16 <dan_p> Must have a ratio of total ratings to total posts of 0.02 or greater.:
+21:20:18 <dan_p> "
+21:20:19 <dan_p> .
+21:20:37 <richardm> bugg_home: yeah if the badges are used outside the forums site-wide would be better
+21:20:53 <fmarier_> should we see what thomaswbell88 comes up with and discuss his "spec" at the next meeting?
+21:21:02 <anitsirk> that also means we'd need post ratings.
+21:21:05 <lamiette_> #agreed
+21:21:10 <dobedobedoh> #agreed
+21:21:11 <richardm> #agree
+21:21:15 <rkabalin_> #agree
+21:21:17 <fmarier_> #agree
+21:21:21 <dan_p> anitsirk: not suggesting that as a solution, just a perspective
+21:21:21 <bugg_home> #agree
+21:21:26 <anitsirk> #agree
+21:21:28 <hughdavenport_ho> #agree
+21:21:28 <thomaswbell88> theres a lot of discussion around it, could it be put out in the developers forum inbetween now and next month?
+21:21:40 <dan_p> anitsirk: in Mooodle land it used to be a manual process
+21:21:44 <lamiette_> #action thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post on the wiki under Specifications in Development
+21:21:47 <dan_p> #agreed
+21:21:48 <anitsirk> thomaswbell88: you could put the spec on the wiki and then have the discussion in the forum
+21:21:52 <lamiette_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Specifications_in_Development
+21:22:01 <bugg_home> when I mentioned institutions, I was thinking that people could have badges assigned by the institution, to highlight where they are from and where they have relevance. *shrugs*
+21:22:53 <thomaswbell88> do I have to agree in meetbot language ? :P
+21:23:00 <anitsirk> some teachers would like to see merrit badges for their students. similar but not quite the same
+21:23:08 <lamiette_> true. you didn't agree and I actioned it! tehehe
+21:23:20 <lamiette_> thomaswbell88: if you agree type: #agreed
+21:23:28 <thomaswbell88> #agreed
+21:23:28 <thomaswbell88> !
+21:23:51 <lamiette_> or is it just #agree
+21:23:54 <dobedobedoh> with the d
+21:24:02 <lamiette_> k
+21:24:07 <lamiette_> rightr
+21:24:10 <lamiette_> brilliant
+21:24:17 <lamiette_> last item
+21:24:27 <lamiette_> #topic Update on the user manual
+21:24:29 <lamiette_> anitsirk:
+21:24:37 <dobedobedoh> lamiette_ Don't forget fmarier's debian item
+21:24:37 <anitsirk> i'll be quick.
+21:24:41 <anitsirk> #info the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the repository contains a Makefile for easy creation of the output file.
+21:24:45 <anitsirk> fmarier_ created a Makefile so that you only need to run that command over your manual txt files and it chooses all the updates ones to convert into html (so far). I'm getting used to the asciidoc markup, and up to now it's been a good experience as the markup is minimal compared to XML. Syntax-highlighting is a definite plus. It will be slow going in the beginning and I have to find a way to write the manual for mahara 1.5 as well because
+21:24:45 <lamiette_> dobedobedoh: doh
+21:24:47 <anitsirk> that way new features will hopefully not get lost. the idea is to have the manual for 1.5 evolving as 1.5 is developed so that it is ready when 1.5 is released.
+21:24:51 <anitsirk> #info the manual sits in git, some information on where it is and how to set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting in vim) is at
+21:24:52 <lamiette_> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup
+21:24:55 <anitsirk> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup
+21:24:59 <anitsirk> We have not set it up with gerrit or any automatic testing yet as i'm the only one (maybe dajan soon) using it. Things to come: the actual html, chunked html (pages by chapter instead of one long document) output and pdf. in git you have the original txt files and the images (png and original svg for translations, adaptions etc. where available) but not the output html files.
+21:25:03 <anitsirk> And the coolest thing of all:
+21:25:07 <anitsirk> #info we now have another mahara family member: the Mahara Scribe thanks to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on the wiki. :-)
+21:25:09 <anitsirk> .
+21:25:19 <anitsirk> mhh. that didn't go as intended.
+21:25:25 <lamiette_> woah, you came prepared
+21:25:40 <anitsirk> wwanted to make it quick
+21:25:44 <anitsirk> #info the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the repository contains a Makefile for easy creation of the output file.
+21:25:50 <anitsirk> #info the manual sits in git, some information on where it is and how to set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting in vim) is at
+21:25:56 <anitsirk> #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup
+21:26:02 <anitsirk> #info we now have another mahara family member: the Mahara Scribe thanks to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on the wiki. :-)
+21:26:16 <anitsirk> .
+21:27:03 <rkabalin_> That a great example how every meeting item should be presented ;)
+21:27:13 <dobedobedoh> indeed
+21:27:43 <dan_p> rkabalin_: well, i'd like to encourage discussion, else no point of having a meeting.. ;-)
+21:27:44 <lamiette_> very quick
+21:28:36 <lamiette_> anitsirk: you're definitely getting your head around git :)
+21:28:54 <anitsirk> oh yeah :-) thanks to fmarier_
+21:28:54 <lamiette_> anyone have any further questions for anitsirk ?
+21:29:37 <lamiette_> otherwise we'll move onto fmarier_ 's debian topic and try wrap up the meeting
+21:29:40 <fmarier_> lamiette_: soon i expect she'll be pushing patches to gerrit
+21:29:55 <fmarier_> and we'll see her name in the 1.5 credits
+21:30:07 <lamiette_> fmarier_: woot!
+21:30:16 <anitsirk> awesome :-)
+21:30:57 <lamiette_> right
+21:31:00 <lamiette_> #topic Invitation to join the Debian Packaging team
+21:31:03 <lamiette_> fmarier_:
+21:31:08 <lamiette_> (sorry I missed you before)
+21:31:13 <fmarier_> well, there's not much to add really :)
+21:31:23 <lamiette_> heh
+21:31:30 <fmarier_> and dobedobedoh and rkabalin_ have already responded to it
+21:31:48 <fmarier_> it was mostly a call for volunteers to expand the one-person packaging team :)
+21:31:53 <bugg_home> so what's the gist?
+21:31:54 <bugg_home> oh
+21:31:56 <richardm> me too
+21:32:04 <dan_p> fmarier_: how much commitment do you need ;-)
+21:32:09 <dobedobedoh> It makes sense for us -- we use debian almost exclusively, and we package pretty much everything we write
+21:32:10 <lamiette_> fmarier_: 3 active members
+21:32:12 <lamiette_> :)
+21:32:22 <dobedobedoh> s/write/use/
+21:32:51 <dan_p> fmarier_: I think its interesting to compare to the Moodle package that you took under your wing
+21:33:10 <fmarier_> the package is only updated when there's a new mahara release, but security fixes need to be backported to all supported distros, so that requires a bit of testing
+21:33:37 <dobedobedoh> Is the Debian package used in ubuntu too?
+21:33:44 <fmarier_> yup
+21:34:19 <fmarier_> anyways, i'll talk to the new recruits and we'll sort something out :)
+21:34:26 <lamiette_> awesome
+21:34:28 <dobedobedoh> fmarier_: Cool :)
+21:34:39 <rkabalin_> fmarier_: thanks
+21:34:50 <fmarier_> rkabalin_: dobedobedoh thanks for volunteering
+21:35:02 <hughdavenport_ho> i can probably help out as well
+21:35:05 * dobedobedoh is excited to be a part of it
+21:35:06 <fmarier_> #info fmarier_ welcomes dobedobedoh and rkabalin_ to the Mahara packaging team
+21:35:25 <lamiette_> congrats
+21:35:26 <lamiette_> okay
+21:35:28 <lamiette_> next meeting
+21:35:44 <lamiette_> #topic Next Meeting date
+21:36:04 <lamiette_> I put a suggested time up of Thursday, 28 July 2011, 08:30:00 UTC
+21:36:14 <lamiette_> just cause it was a month away
+21:36:32 <dan_p> #agree
+21:36:35 <fmarier_> if we make it the week of the 1 Aug, I might be able to make it
+21:36:46 <fmarier_> but I can't the week before
+21:37:08 <lamiette_> but that actually is wrong now cause of apparently us having summer over here or something (though it seems more wintery)
+21:37:16 <dobedobedoh> I was going to suggest that, for their own sanity, we have a chair who is working in their evening -- saves you getting up even earlier to prepare for an early meeting
+21:37:27 <lamiette_> fmarier_: yeah, incidentally I can't make the date I suggested as I'll be in Scotland :P
+21:37:31 <anitsirk> 28th is not good as it is moodlemoot nz and i may not be back yet (as we are on in the evening)
+21:37:43 <fmarier_> alright, so 28th is out :)
+21:37:52 <bugg_home> so the following thursday?
+21:37:53 <fmarier_> how about 3 Aug?
+21:37:58 <lamiette_> week of the 1st of August?
+21:38:14 <anitsirk> works for me
+21:38:19 <rkabalin_> 3th is fine with me
+21:38:30 <hughdavenport_ho> fine with me
+21:38:31 <dobedobedoh> 3rd august @ 19:30 NZST; 4th August @ 08:30 GMT Is that?
+21:38:44 <anitsirk> eh nope. rather the other way around ;-)
+21:38:54 <anitsirk> but as we are in the evening, it's morning the same day for you
+21:38:58 <fmarier_> dobedobedoh: stick to UTC dates only, it reduces the number of possible errors :)
+21:39:02 <lamiette_> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730
+21:39:07 <lamiette_> does that look right?
+21:39:28 <anitsirk> ye
+21:39:30 <fmarier_> #agreed
+21:39:30 <anitsirk> yep
+21:39:35 <rkabalin_> #agreed
+21:39:37 <dan_p> #agreed
+21:39:43 <lamiette_> #agreed
+21:39:43 <dobedobedoh> #agreed
+21:39:44 <bugg_home> #agreed
+21:39:50 <richardm> #agreed
+21:39:57 <thomaswbell88> #agreed
+21:39:58 <hughdavenport_ho> #agreed
+21:40:02 <anitsirk> #agreed
+21:40:18 <lamiette_> #link http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730
+21:40:47 <lamiette_> who wants to chair next time?
+21:41:10 <dan_p> I will volunteer (with a caveat)
+21:41:25 <bugg_home> I could give it a go, it's in my evening time
+21:41:44 <lamiette_> #info next meeting Wednesday, 3 August 2011, 07:30:00 UTC time
+21:41:46 * dobedobedoh wonders what dan_p's caveat is!
+21:42:20 <dan_p> caveat is that lamiette_ lets me insert an AOB into this meeting
+21:42:20 <lamiette_> dan_p: ?
+21:43:05 <dan_p> AOB= any other business
+21:43:06 <lamiette_> *sigh*
+21:43:09 <lamiette_> if you must
+21:43:40 <dan_p> I'd like to apologise for the poor availability of jenkins.mahara.org. Turns out the old server we put it on is in bad shape. Moving to our VM cluster and also less dependency on me in LUNS is in the pipeline, as well as more tests.
+21:44:25 <dan_p> for now, if you can't get hold of me, support@luns.net.uk will help you ;-)
+21:44:45 <dan_p> .
+21:44:45 <fmarier_> and i'd like to thank dan_p and LUNS for setting it up. it's really good to have and i really like how you added the link to the reports in the -1 comments :)
+21:44:59 <lamiette_> definitely
+21:45:00 <lamiette_> thanks dan_p
+21:45:20 <richardm> yep, thanks heaps dan_p, it's already been very useful
+21:46:04 <lamiette_> cool
+21:46:05 <lamiette_> right
+21:46:12 <lamiette_> nearing 11pm here
+21:46:16 <dobedobedoh> thanks to lamiette_ for chairing tonight
+21:46:16 <lamiette_> so I think meeting over
+21:46:20 <lamiette_> (poorly)
+21:46:23 <lamiette_> :)
+21:46:24 <anitsirk> thank you, lamiette_
+21:46:33 <pxh> lamiette_: thanks
+21:46:38 <rkabalin_> thank you lamiette_
+21:46:39 <hughdavenport_ho> thx
+21:46:41 <bugg_home> thanks lamiette_ !
+21:46:43 <richardm> thanks lamiette_
+21:46:47 <fmarier_> thanks lamiette_
+21:46:47 <anitsirk> we made it under 2.5 hours, lamiette_! :-)
+21:46:59 <lamiette_> anitsirk: yay!
+21:47:06 <dan_p> thanks lamiette_
+21:47:08 <thomaswbell88> ty lamiette_ ! :D
+21:47:17 <thomaswbell88> my very first
+21:47:24 <thomaswbell88> ;D
+21:47:24 <lamiette_> okay everyone ! Ka Kite
+21:47:27 <lamiette_> #endmeeting
+ diff --git a/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.txt b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.txt new file mode 100644 index 0000000000000000000000000000000000000000..8e8b9970114b12877a92f58cc7d11df28bbbebfa --- /dev/null +++ b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.txt @@ -0,0 +1,690 @@ +19:35:46 #startmeeting +19:35:46 Meeting started Wed Jun 29 19:35:46 2011 UTC. The chair is lamiette_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. +19:35:46 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic. +19:35:54 #topic Meeting Attendees +19:36:31 #info dobedobedoh is Andrew Nicols - LUNS Ltd, UK +19:36:36 #info anitsirk is Kristina Hoeppner from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ +19:36:46 #info rkabalin_ is Ruslan Kabalin, LUNS Ltd., Lancaster, UK +19:36:52 #info richardm is Richard Mansfield from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ +19:37:02 #info lamiette_ is Stacey Walker from Catalyst IT in Brighton UK +19:37:06 #info hughdavenport_ho is Hugh Davenport from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ +19:37:10 anitsirk: what did i do ? +19:37:22 oh you're doing meetings +19:37:24 #info dan_p_ is Dan Poltawski, LUNS ltd uk (on train) +19:37:28 #info thomaswbell88 is Thomas Bell from TDM Ltd, UK +19:37:29 * Mjollnir` goes away again +19:37:30 #info is Francois Marier +19:37:30 #info bugg_home is Brett Wilkinsa from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ +19:37:39 Brett Wilkins* +19:37:43 #info ricardomano is Richard Hand from TDM Ltd, UK +19:37:49 hi Mjollnir`: you were on the train once on your laptop and also walking down the platform with your laptop open so you could attend the first dev meeting :-) +19:38:50 oh yes +19:38:54 kevin made a photo +19:39:04 right, is that everyone ? +19:39:12 Are we doing the . Thing again, for new atendees? +19:39:20 pxh was here earlier +19:39:23 ? +19:39:26 ! thing sounds good, what is thing? +19:40:06 #info pxh is Piers Harding from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ +19:40:31 * pxh will be here for 20 minutes +19:40:33 dan_p_: what is the . thing for new attendees? +19:40:36 the . (on a single line) is to indicate that you're doing talking +19:40:48 so even if you write a multi-line comment +19:40:59 like this one, with enters between them +19:40:59 pxh: that means we should talk about web services first? +19:41:12 anitsirk: I agree +19:41:14 then you can still indicate you're done +19:41:15 . +19:41:22 sorry fmarier_ +19:41:39 When you finish what you are saying put a . On line when done. So people dont need to wait +19:41:46 anitsirk: can do - was not sure what people want to know about it ? +19:41:51 Argh sorry. Slowtyper +19:42:42 pxh: There was. Some interest in web services at mahara uk, would be good to know what you are working on +19:42:48 . +19:42:59 . +19:43:00 OK +19:43:07 #topic MNet future -- We're adding Web Services to 1.5 +19:43:16 so the basic are: +19:43:18 hmm no power;) +19:43:31 #topic MNet future -- We're adding Web Services to 1.5 +19:43:33 documentation is at https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices +19:43:43 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices +19:44:08 I farmed it out into an artefact plugin because it is directly derived from Moodle web services in 2.x +19:45:19 it follows the pattern of Moodle Web Services quite closely in terms of authentication via tokens or username/password, and it's use of Zend web services +19:46:05 So, it can potentially replace Mnet feature? +19:46:06 features are: SOAP, REST (really just basic HTTP post parameters or JSON), and XML-RPC +19:46:36 Auth via WSEE for SOAP, as well as the tokens/users (as mentioned before) +19:47:13 it's plugable - as in it searches for externallib.php, and service.php definition files (like Moodle) at upgrade +19:47:26 But Moodle web services are (supposed to be) pluggable, is the same true here +19:47:37 rkabalin_: I would hope that it could quite easily replace mnet if needed +19:47:41 Grr, sorry +19:47:45 * rkabalin_ sorry for interrupting +19:47:58 yes dan_p - it is +19:48:36 more features: has example commandline clients, and I'm just about to commit an interactive web based test client +19:48:42 Are there advantages/limitations of making it a plugin itself? +19:48:47 this was for the Ministry of Education NZ +19:49:08 they wanted SOAP, but I wanted the rest (pun intended) +19:49:29 pxh: nice one :) +19:49:41 lol. you probably need it as well ;-) +19:49:52 It also can be used as API for various remote user/group/institution management tasks +19:49:58 Harsh! +19:50:00 from the MoE point of iew the main thing missing is signatures and encryption from WSSE - but nobody uses it +19:50:11 ... but they are a guvament department +19:50:44 yup - rkabalin_ - should have said that - there are 19 functions in the API already +19:50:56 that is cool +19:51:22 why an artefact plugin and not a new top level plugin type ? +19:51:24 and - to finish - I want to add OAuth as that will open it up properly to 3rd party dev +19:51:25 . +19:51:28 not that i really have any say :) +19:51:45 Mjollnir`: ignorance probably +19:51:55 pxh, can it talk to moodle (2.x) via this API? +19:52:00 Mjollnir`: time constraints, we'll be moving it +19:52:27 Mjollnir`: ... on my part that is +19:52:55 is it really less work to make it an artefact plugin and have to implement contracts that you don't need than make a new top level plugin ? eh, maybe i dunno +19:52:59 :) +19:53:19 * dan_p_ alighting train, connectivity unknown +19:53:24 bugg_home: I haven't had time to test this yet - one of the things I wanted to do was to try and get it talking over the Moodle hub (in a limited way) but I'm still trying to deliver the original requirement to the MoE +19:54:27 .. as they are paying for it at the moment +19:54:29 pxh: so it's derived from Moodle 2.x but tested/written to work with 1.9 only at this stage? +19:56:14 lamiette_: I haven't got as far as integration testing etc. with Moodle yet - once I get the MoE requirement behind me - I can look at making this useful to the wider Mahara community +19:56:25 awesome +19:57:13 pxh: Sounds good +19:57:18 yeah, that sounds great +19:57:21 but anyway - useful things would be OAuth, and MNet replacement +19:57:23 Look forward to reviewing on gerrit for master ;) +19:57:36 #info pxh has writtten a web services framework, based on the Moodle 2.0 web services Further information at https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices +19:57:46 (sorry guys, i'm a bit slow on this chairing thing!) +19:58:01 the first lms to integrate it with is not moodle to ensure that the api also works with others as mahara and moodle are closer to each other than mahara and another system +19:58:02 so with one feature we can potentially resolve two issues: Mnet and API +19:59:00 #info pxh> features are: SOAP, REST (really just basic HTTP post parameters or JSON), and XML-RPC +19:59:14 #info Auth via WSEE for SOAP, as well as the tokens/users (as mentioned before) +19:59:23 pxh: When do you expect to submit this, and are you hoping to have it in 1.5? +20:00:38 any more questions for pxh ? +20:00:41 dobedobedoh: it needs work on cleaning the code base out - removing unnecessary cruft from the Moodle base - then it needs some fairly critical review +20:00:46 * rkabalin_ thinks it is already in contrib +20:01:19 rkabalin_ yup - in contrib +20:01:28 .. but not in core +20:01:34 Cool. Hadn't seen it +20:01:47 * dobedobedoh has no further questions +20:01:58 .. if it were to go in core then it would be moved out of being an artefact plugin +20:02:08 righto, we're half an hour through and pxh said he had to move on at 20minutes +20:02:26 plugin is at https://gitorious.org/mahara-contrib/artefact-webservice +20:02:38 #link https://gitorious.org/mahara-contrib/artefact-webservice +20:02:53 #info available as a contrib plugin +20:02:53 lamiette_: thought I was on duty to take kids to school - but Marysia is doing it +20:03:07 lucky :) +20:03:31 rkabalin_: did you want to talk about the future of MNET while we're on a similar topic? +20:03:39 or was that just a lead in to pxh web service? +20:04:30 Yep, a sort of, I was just going to rise the issue and notify that we have to start thinking about Mnet stuff +20:04:58 I shall topic it and you can have the stage +20:05:12 not really needed +20:05:20 okay ... +20:05:21 since we covered it in this discussion +20:05:38 .. +20:05:38 I'm going to info something though :P +20:06:14 #info we have to start thinking about Mnet stuff: largely due to this from Moodle HQ http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=175158 +20:06:25 right, is that all for MNET and web services? +20:06:37 that's all from me +20:06:44 yep +20:06:58 #topic Bug status proposal +20:07:05 fmarier_: this one was yours +20:07:49 ok, so let me start with the milestone thing +20:08:08 so far, we've used milestones on the tracker for two things +20:08:31 1- as a bit of a TODO list for the upcoming release (that is, bugs that have a milestone but aren't done yet) +20:09:06 2- as a changelog or a detailed version of the release notes (once the release is done and the bugs are fixed) +20:09:26 to make this more useful for #2, I'd like to propose the following +20:10:02 we omit from the milestone bugs that don't apply to the stable releases +20:10:24 so for example, if you add a new feature (say sitemaps) and they have a bug, +20:10:49 then the fixup bug doesn't retain the 1.5 milestone when it's fixed +20:11:41 the original feature bug goes onto the 1.5 milestone of course because it's one of the relevant changes from the stable branches, but the bug that got fixed in it isn't very relevant to people upgrading from 1.4 +20:12:12 #info milestones have been used for marking bugs to upcoming releases and as for a changelog/detailed version of the release notes +20:12:15 in that case, you'd just mark the bug as "fix released" without a milestone +20:12:15 fmarier_: makes sense to me +20:12:31 because when you use "fix committed", you must specify a milestone +20:12:42 So the milestone is more for bugs fixed since the last release, rather than aimed for the next +20:12:55 otherwise the bug gets into that state and isn't listed anywhere so nobody remembers to flick it to fix released once 1.5 is out :) +20:13:03 dobedobedoh: it's for both +20:13:27 Ah I see +20:13:28 but once a bug is fixed, you can remove the milestone if it doesn't make sense to have it stick around +20:13:30 #info suggestion: for better changelog only mark main feature bugs with the milestone and any follow up fixes to that feature just as "fix committed" ommiting the milestone +20:13:47 lamiette_: that's slightly wrong +20:13:50 oh +20:13:55 I misunderstood then sorry +20:14:03 we mark ALL new features against the milestone +20:14:10 and all bug fixes that apply to 1.4 +20:14:12 #undo +20:14:12 Removing item from minutes: +20:14:22 it's the bugs that only affect master that don't need to go on there +20:14:35 for example, we broke the creation of new institutions recently +20:14:51 but that doesn't need to be in our release notes, because we've never release a version of mahara with that bug +20:15:12 so we would mark it as "fix release" with no milestone once it's been merged +20:15:13 . +20:15:25 I see fmarier_ +20:16:31 so basically all new features and previous relese fixes are marked with milestone +20:16:31 so anyways, i want to run it past all of you to see if you have any objections +20:17:15 richardm brought something up: if you change a new feature in a significant way, then that should probably also have the milestone set so that it's visible +20:17:45 fmarier_: yup +20:17:49 but if you're just fixing it so that it does what it was supposed to do in the first place when you merged it on master, then it's probably not worth it +20:17:55 . +20:18:10 rkabalin_: yes +20:18:11 i'd also suggest we could take care of thta case by repoening the feature bug +20:18:30 richardm: true +20:19:05 richardm: so in the case (using something I know) of dropdowns we could open the existing feature bug again for the inst membership navigation move to Groups yeah? +20:19:22 lamiette_: yeah, that's a good idea +20:19:25 sweet +20:19:28 sounds good +20:19:47 sometimes if it's a regression we don't know what feature caused it though :( +20:20:14 richardm: I suppose this only works for things we know then, but that'd at least take care of a fair amount +20:20:33 richardm: if you know it's only on master, then you don't need the milestone +20:21:16 so everyone understand/ in agreement? +20:21:29 what i'm suggesting is a guideline, we can see how it goes and adjust if anything we haven't thought about pops up +20:21:34 fmarier_: will you document this? :) +20:21:49 yes, i'll update the bug status page if everybody agrees +20:21:59 I like reopening idea, we will have less bugs then and it will be easier to follow all the stuff related to the particular featute +20:22:09 I agree +20:22:45 #action fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage guidelines +20:23:08 less issues on the tracker I mean +20:23:12 fmarier_: you had a couple more points in that list? +20:23:24 the other minor point i had in there was that all new features added to master should have a bug on the tracker +20:23:35 that will help heaps when we write the release notes for 1.5 :) +20:23:36 agreed +20:23:51 yup, agreed +20:23:53 makes sense +20:24:01 I was also going to suggest that we add a Makefile target to check that they're also specified in the commit message +20:24:07 agree (even though i'm a serial offender) +20:24:09 In a specific format +20:24:19 dobedobedoh: that's on fmarier_ 's list :) +20:24:24 * dobedobedoh added it there ;) +20:24:31 ohhhhh I seee +20:24:38 dobedobedoh: that would however imply that every commit needs a bug number, right? +20:24:47 which we haven't enforced so far +20:24:52 Correct +20:25:00 I thought that the two would go pretty much hand-in-hand +20:25:04 do people want that? +20:25:18 #info every new feature on master should have a bug report associated with it +20:25:25 i personnally can see that for some small commits, it's a bit overkill +20:25:29 (like a typo fix) +20:25:35 sortof makes sense +20:25:45 I'm less keen on forcing bug numbers for every commit +20:25:50 I think it would really help with the changelogs -- as I understand (and correct me if I'm wrong), it would automatically fill the changelog -- https://launchpad.net/mahara/1.4/1.4.0 under "View the full changelog" +20:25:50 it'd be a good rule of thumb, but not something to actively enforce +20:25:58 Fair enough +20:26:04 small fixes can just be tagged to a default bug of say "Fix typos" etc +20:26:17 dobedobedoh: i thnk it's the milestones that fill the changelog +20:26:24 yeah perhaps it should be actively requested by reviewers +20:26:35 except for trivial cases +20:26:51 fmarier_: if we do that we could see how often bug numbers are requested and used +20:26:54 we could put it in the minaccept check, and then discard it if it's trivial +20:26:55 Perhaps that's a better solution -- reviewers requesting it +20:27:00 and if it's then worth making it an enforcement etc +20:27:23 Or, if it is trivial, using something like (minorbug) instead of (bug #xyz) +20:27:24 but better +20:27:24 . +20:27:59 dobedobedoh: yeah, I like minorbug idea +20:28:06 to me, it seems similar to: -1, your commit message doesn't really explain what you did +20:28:22 it's a subjective thing that relies on the reviewer's good judgment +20:28:52 I think it's also overkill when you have a series of commits for 1 feature +20:28:53 I'm happy to leave it up to the reviewer +20:29:04 it doesn't always make sense to use the same bug number +20:29:17 (but maybe you need to create another bug at that point) +20:29:28 richardm: agreed. +20:29:57 right, lets move on yeah? +20:30:26 I don't mind either way, but I think that we should be actively trying to encourage use of bug #s so reviewers demanding works for me :) +20:30:27 do we have agreement on being stricter about forgotten bug numbers without making it mandatory? +20:30:43 yes, agree +20:30:46 (mandatory for new features though) +20:30:49 yup +20:31:00 agree +20:31:03 yup +20:31:10 yes +20:31:14 yes +20:32:02 #info reviewers to be stricter about suitable bug numbers for features submitted to gerrit - isn't mandatory though +20:32:26 right, a quick topic now: +20:32:31 #topic MaharaUK2011 +20:32:40 seeing as this just happened +20:33:00 i wanted to bring it to attention in case anyone had anything interesting to say about it +20:33:48 one rumor i've heard from it is that we're going to have a northern UK maharauk12 ;) +20:34:02 That's the plan +20:34:29 LUNS and TDM have both offered to host maharauk, so we've suggested that 12 is in Lancaster, hosted by LUNS +20:34:35 and 13 is in the West Midlands, hosted by TDM +20:34:46 I don't think its a underground secret, but it's planned ... as above :P +20:34:58 #info LUNS and TDM have both offered to host maharauk, so we've suggested that 12 is in Lancaster, hosted by LUNS and 13 is in the West Midlands, hosted by TDM +20:35:06 We're waiting for feedback from the governance group as far as I understand +20:35:18 sweet +20:35:24 sam told me that meredith and roger are writing the conference report. lamiette_ do you have any idea if there is a 100 words or so in it for the newsletter (out tomorrow) or shall i just write that it happened at that the report will be on the web site soon? +20:35:28 . +20:35:30 other things were: +20:35:39 great interest in skins from lots of people +20:35:51 There was also talk about some entity hosting online 'conferences' inbetween during the year +20:35:58 . +20:36:20 thomaswbell88: webinar type things? +20:36:33 and anitsirk's what was it 22.5 million ways to get involved (?) being quite a popular discussion +20:37:01 yep, it was asked as a question by a delegate and followed up with a few, mmm's and arrr's +20:37:30 anitsirk: not sure, but I can check with them tomorrow morning +20:37:33 * dobedobedoh has a list of feature ideas that he thought up during the conference to add to the tracker +20:37:40 anitsirk: newsletter for tomorrow NZ time yeah? +20:38:08 * lamiette_ and paul did the navigation dropdown thing while at the conference +20:38:12 haven't heard back from meredith yet. yep, NZ time. so your tomorrow morning would still be fine if the text comes through with it. just 100-150 words though please. that's enough. +20:38:18 inspired by thomaswbell88's page editing JS +20:38:37 anitsirk: I'll chase it up +20:39:02 oh, fmarier_ : we had the keysigning party +20:39:02 thank you. otherwise i'll just mention it and refer to the web site +20:39:04 there was no cake +20:39:12 huh? +20:39:25 The key signing party consisted of lamiette, rkabalin, and myselft +20:39:32 it was rocking! +20:39:37 what is a key signing party? +20:39:42 cool, we'll have a stronger trust path between NZ and the UK now :) +20:39:53 Indeed :) +20:39:59 oh the gpg key? +20:40:02 anitsirk: signing each other's gpg keys +20:40:02 anitsirk: signing gpg keys, so we know to trust each other +20:40:06 they are real people now, not I I'm afraid +20:40:17 #link http://cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/keysigning_party/en/keysigning_party.html +20:40:21 for the gory details +20:40:30 thomaswbell88: We'll get you gitted and gpg'd up soon Im' sure ;) +20:40:55 #info There was also talk about some entity hosting online 'conferences' inbetween during the year (webinar type things) +20:41:02 rkabalin did a presentation on gerrit, and I did a tour of git to get people more interested in developing features +20:41:23 slides are available online +20:41:28 emphasis was definitely on contributing to mahara this year +20:41:34 Definately +20:41:37 oh slide links everyone ? +20:42:20 #info twitter hashtag #maharauk11 for anyone interested in seeing what attendees had to say +20:42:39 #link http://t.co/dFHqjYX - Git in Mahara +20:43:00 http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations - both my presentations +20:43:28 I fumbled through a 'non-presentation' (no slides) on the dev day +20:43:29 #link http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations +20:44:10 #link http://www.slideshare.net/andrewnicols/presentations for mine +20:44:25 ok. if everybody posts their presentation links, here's the 21 3/4 ways to get involved in mahara (recording is so far only on youtube) +20:44:26 rkabalin_: i really liked your gerrit presentation +20:44:28 #link http://www.slideshare.net/4nitsirk/21-34-ways-to-get-involved-in-mahara +20:44:44 If anyone is interested in more info on the isolated institutions feature, rkabalin also presented on that +20:44:44 well, the slide contents at least, i wasn't there to see the live thing ;-) +20:44:47 fmarier_: thanks +20:44:48 thomaswbell88's tools panel http://yfrog.com/gzbkqiej +20:45:01 #link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rbz9vST0CLw recording +20:45:15 * dobedobedoh thinks that's all he has to say about maharauk11 +20:45:45 #link Mark Osbornes keynote http://prezi.com/dubgzzefzioj/maharauk-open-for-learning/ +20:45:48 yup +20:45:50 lets move on +20:46:05 #topic Mahara Reviewer applications# +20:46:12 we have three: +20:46:17 hughdavenport_ho: +20:46:20 bugg_home: +20:46:24 and lordp +20:46:28 wait +20:46:35 ? +20:46:48 I was going to mention thomaswbell88's idea +20:47:00 about badges on the forum +20:47:18 shall we just do it after the applications? +20:47:18 (see 3.2 on agenda) +20:47:23 ok +20:47:38 oh right, sorry rkabalin_ +20:47:57 applicants, please step forward. lorp should be here now as well. +20:48:16 hello +20:48:22 hi all +20:48:33 #info Hugh Davenport Mahara reviewer application +20:48:49 #info Brett Wilkins Mahara reviewer application +20:49:09 so who is a current reviewer (and online) at the moment? +20:49:14 * fmarier_ is a reviewer +20:49:21 * dobedobedoh is a reviewer +20:49:26 #info Darryl Hamilton Mahara reviewer application +20:49:32 I think I am +20:49:38 #info lordp is Darryl Hamilton +20:49:46 * rkabalin_ is reviewer +20:49:49 * richardm is a reviewer +20:50:03 lamiette_: yup you are +20:50:12 Just missing dan_p who'se probably lost packets +20:50:17 so we've got five? +20:50:24 5 out of 6 +20:50:26 is five what we need? +20:50:38 * lamiette_ forgets how many we need +20:50:48 we haven't really set a quorum, this is the first time we do this :) +20:51:01 but if we had only 1, it would be a bit dodgy +20:51:07 right, let the games begin then! +20:51:07 5 is plenty i'd say +20:51:11 consensus decision rules, with those at the meeting entitled to vote +20:51:33 first up: hughdavenport_ho +20:51:35 * dan_p is back +20:51:37 hello +20:51:38 dobedobedoh: those _reviewers_ at the meeting :) +20:51:39 http://meetbot.mahara.org/mahara-dev/2010/mahara-dev.2010-11-10-07.34.html FYI +20:51:52 sorry yes, only reviewers +20:52:13 hmm, I haven't been doing "agrees" oops +20:52:42 anyway - vote? +20:53:06 and who is sponsoring +20:53:11 fmarier_: are you for all three? +20:53:15 any questions for hughdavenport_ho ? +20:53:18 some info on what I have done https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Hughdavenport +20:54:03 . +20:54:44 btw, the "becoming a reviewer" process has been documented here: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Code_Review +20:55:14 (slightly modified version from the meeting log above given that we no longer have committers) +20:56:18 do people need more time to read hughdavenport_ho bugg_home and lordp 's pages? +20:56:30 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Code_Review +20:56:40 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Hughdavenport +20:56:54 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Brettwilkins +20:57:00 * dobedobedoh is ready to vote +20:57:01 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Darrylh +20:57:39 * fmarier_ is ready as well +20:57:47 * rkabalin_ ready to vote, in fact read through their reports prior the meeting +20:57:53 ditto +20:57:59 yep, me too +20:58:12 ready to vote!! +20:58:25 dan_p: awesome we have a full house :) +20:58:34 lamiette_: ready? +20:58:40 yup +20:59:02 * fmarier_ moves to accept hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer +20:59:19 * rkabalin_ accepts hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer +20:59:20 * dobedobedoh moves to accept hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer +20:59:36 * richardm accepts hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer +20:59:42 * dan_p accepts hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer +20:59:54 * lamiette_ moves to accept hughdavenport_ho as a Mahara reviewer +21:00:18 fire alarm at catalyst +21:00:23 fireall at catalystback in a minute or later +21:00:28 lol +21:00:30 typical +21:00:31 nice :) +21:00:31 :P +21:00:35 lol +21:00:37 lets talk about them while they're gone +21:00:40 we were overdue for a firedrill +21:00:43 best timimg +21:00:50 * fmarier_ is supposed to be the fire warden +21:00:56 heh +21:01:03 * bugg_home is supposed to be fmarier_'s backup +21:01:08 we can still vote without them, all the reviewers are still here +21:01:09 xD +21:01:12 double heh +21:01:24 k, anyway +21:01:24 who's not here? just anitsirk ? +21:01:28 was that all of us? +21:01:29 fmarier_: peterb won't even be at work yet +21:01:37 fmarier_: anitsirk and lordp +21:01:45 ok, let's vote on bugg_home then +21:02:48 lamiette_: that was all of you +21:03:04 cool +21:03:05 any questions for bugg_home? +21:03:05 #agreed Hugh Davenport to become Mahara reviewer +21:04:09 none from me +21:04:20 I was at a wedding this weekend, the mahara-dev proces feels strangely familiar ;-) +21:04:32 dan_p: lol +21:04:47 who's kissing the bride then? +21:04:51 hah, those catalyst folk, what lols +21:04:53 * fmarier_ bags not +21:04:56 uhhh... +21:04:57 who's the bride? +21:04:58 ooh shit +21:05:01 they're back :p +21:05:08 * hughdavenport_ho thinks i should leave now... +21:05:42 moving on +21:06:19 * lamiette_ moves to accept bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer +21:06:28 * dobedobedoh accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer +21:06:53 #agree +21:06:55 * richardm accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer +21:07:06 * rkabalin_ accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer +21:07:17 * dan_p accepts bugg_home as a Mahara reviewer +21:07:31 arise, sir bugg_home +21:08:09 richardm: I'll try to not be sick and make it into work today ;) +21:08:22 arise, sir bugg +21:08:44 * dan_p wonders if we can sneak any extra mahara-dev vows +21:08:45 right, so time for lordp +21:09:12 * dobedobedoh accepts lordp as a Mahara reviewer +21:09:23 #agree +21:09:26 #agreed Brett Wilkins to become a Mahara reviewer +21:09:28 * rkabalin_ accepts lordp as a Mahara reviewer +21:09:29 * richardm accepts lordp as a Mahara reviewer +21:09:30 #agree +21:09:38 fmarier_: can I action these to you? +21:09:43 catalystas are coming back now +21:09:44 they're already done! +21:09:49 dobedobedoh: oh really? +21:09:56 * dobedobedoh has had two e-mails so far +21:09:57 cool +21:10:05 * lamiette_ has ridiculously slow emial +21:10:07 *email +21:10:08 right +21:10:29 that's all the applications so lets get back to rkabalin_ and thomaswbell88 forum badge thingamees +21:10:37 is dan_p still here? +21:10:43 yep +21:10:49 dd you vote on lordp ? +21:10:50 fmarier: worst time ever for a fire drill as neither our fir wardens from level 6 were there. ;-) +21:11:00 fir = fire +21:11:01 * dan_p accepts lordp as a Mahara reviwer +21:11:05 anitsirk: and I, their backup, was not either +21:11:24 anitsirk: yeah l6 is going to fail this one :) +21:11:26 nope. i cleared l6 on behalf of you guys so that we could get back in +21:11:38 *ahem* it's just gone 10pm over here ... +21:11:41 :) +21:11:42 we usually pass the afternoon ones though :) +21:11:49 with flying colors +21:11:59 ok. lordp is back as well. +21:12:19 rkabalin_ and thomaswbell88's forum badges! +21:12:26 :P +21:12:27 right +21:12:27 lordp: please add your catalyst email address on launchpad +21:13:05 since thomaswbell88 is here, he might tell us about his idea himself +21:13:10 sure +21:13:12 unless he's fallen asleep .. +21:13:13 ;) +21:13:15 zzz +21:13:16 topic change? +21:13:27 #topic mahara.org forum badges +21:13:31 there +21:13:34 :p +21:13:43 thomaswbell88: go for it +21:14:16 forum badges are used in many community forums to engage members.. examples for me are Ubuntu community +21:14:27 i'm sure you've all seen them around? +21:14:39 Most of you would have a Core Developer 'badge' +21:14:59 or Code Reviewer for those privelaged +21:15:01 we've already got lots of cool icons we can use for these badges :) +21:15:04 ;P +21:15:10 We'd probably have to modify the forum code +21:15:12 yep. sounds good +21:15:14 * rkabalin_ Moodle forum is another example +21:15:15 fmarier_: done +21:15:19 Sounds good to me +21:15:34 that sounds like a cool idea +21:15:37 I thought it might engage more people to get involved in the contribution, which is certainly an issue i think? +21:15:45 * lamiette_ likes more pretty pictures +21:15:48 thomaswbell88: do you want to start a wiki page with the list of badges you thought about? +21:16:07 sure +21:16:12 it could go on here: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Specifications_in_Development +21:16:32 since it will be a new Mahara feature for mahara.org (but could be in core as well) +21:16:56 another good thing that you also know who replied to you on the forum - core developer, translator, contributior or just an ordinary user +21:17:06 rkabalin_: yeah +21:17:11 absolutely rkabalin +21:17:11 yeah i vote for in core +21:17:16 it would be good also to flesh out how people earn badges, who gives them, how, etc. +21:17:26 fmarier_: we'd want to have institution-definable badges, in that case? +21:17:44 bugg_home: maybe, but we could start with site-wide ones +21:17:48 group admin might be better, seeing as the forums are all in groups +21:17:57 ah +21:18:02 like moderators +21:18:04 i think it would also be good to see other forum posts from the same author more easily. the google search is ehm not really good. the dates and post info is all wrong for most things +21:18:13 have you guys seen teh particularl helpful moodlers group in moodle? +21:18:22 if it's too complicated or too much work, then it's less likely it will happen +21:18:24 or it could be just a user reputation setting - we can just assign them +21:18:27 fmarier_: could be like requested group membership or something - reviewers group, contrib plugins group, security group etc yeah +21:18:34 dan_p: yeah that's a pretty good one +21:18:42 would it be cool if the badges could be site-wide? that way when you place feedback on a pagge then your badges can show up there too +21:18:42 groups are not associated with institutions, bugg_home +21:18:54 phm is algorithimically driven atm +21:19:59 "These people have written a lot of "useful" posts in the Using Moodle forums recently, as determined by the Moodle community when they rate posts. +21:20:02 The formula is currently: +21:20:05 Must have posted something in the past 60 days +21:20:07 Must have been rated "Useful" 14 or more times, by more than 8 raters +21:20:16 Must have a ratio of total ratings to total posts of 0.02 or greater.: +21:20:18 " +21:20:19 . +21:20:37 bugg_home: yeah if the badges are used outside the forums site-wide would be better +21:20:53 should we see what thomaswbell88 comes up with and discuss his "spec" at the next meeting? +21:21:02 that also means we'd need post ratings. +21:21:05 #agreed +21:21:10 #agreed +21:21:11 #agree +21:21:15 #agree +21:21:17 #agree +21:21:21 anitsirk: not suggesting that as a solution, just a perspective +21:21:21 #agree +21:21:26 #agree +21:21:28 #agree +21:21:28 theres a lot of discussion around it, could it be put out in the developers forum inbetween now and next month? +21:21:40 anitsirk: in Mooodle land it used to be a manual process +21:21:44 #action thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post on the wiki under Specifications in Development +21:21:47 #agreed +21:21:48 thomaswbell88: you could put the spec on the wiki and then have the discussion in the forum +21:21:52 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Specifications_in_Development +21:22:01 when I mentioned institutions, I was thinking that people could have badges assigned by the institution, to highlight where they are from and where they have relevance. *shrugs* +21:22:53 do I have to agree in meetbot language ? :P +21:23:00 some teachers would like to see merrit badges for their students. similar but not quite the same +21:23:08 true. you didn't agree and I actioned it! tehehe +21:23:20 thomaswbell88: if you agree type: #agreed +21:23:28 #agreed +21:23:28 ! +21:23:51 or is it just #agree +21:23:54 with the d +21:24:02 k +21:24:07 rightr +21:24:10 brilliant +21:24:17 last item +21:24:27 #topic Update on the user manual +21:24:29 anitsirk: +21:24:37 lamiette_ Don't forget fmarier's debian item +21:24:37 i'll be quick. +21:24:41 #info the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the repository contains a Makefile for easy creation of the output file. +21:24:45 fmarier_ created a Makefile so that you only need to run that command over your manual txt files and it chooses all the updates ones to convert into html (so far). I'm getting used to the asciidoc markup, and up to now it's been a good experience as the markup is minimal compared to XML. Syntax-highlighting is a definite plus. It will be slow going in the beginning and I have to find a way to write the manual for mahara 1.5 as well because +21:24:45 dobedobedoh: doh +21:24:47 that way new features will hopefully not get lost. the idea is to have the manual for 1.5 evolving as 1.5 is developed so that it is ready when 1.5 is released. +21:24:51 #info the manual sits in git, some information on where it is and how to set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting in vim) is at +21:24:52 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup +21:24:55 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup +21:24:59 We have not set it up with gerrit or any automatic testing yet as i'm the only one (maybe dajan soon) using it. Things to come: the actual html, chunked html (pages by chapter instead of one long document) output and pdf. in git you have the original txt files and the images (png and original svg for translations, adaptions etc. where available) but not the output html files. +21:25:03 And the coolest thing of all: +21:25:07 #info we now have another mahara family member: the Mahara Scribe thanks to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on the wiki. :-) +21:25:09 . +21:25:19 mhh. that didn't go as intended. +21:25:25 woah, you came prepared +21:25:40 wwanted to make it quick +21:25:44 #info the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the repository contains a Makefile for easy creation of the output file. +21:25:50 #info the manual sits in git, some information on where it is and how to set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting in vim) is at +21:25:56 #link https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup +21:26:02 #info we now have another mahara family member: the Mahara Scribe thanks to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on the wiki. :-) +21:26:16 . +21:27:03 That a great example how every meeting item should be presented ;) +21:27:13 indeed +21:27:43 rkabalin_: well, i'd like to encourage discussion, else no point of having a meeting.. ;-) +21:27:44 very quick +21:28:36 anitsirk: you're definitely getting your head around git :) +21:28:54 oh yeah :-) thanks to fmarier_ +21:28:54 anyone have any further questions for anitsirk ? +21:29:37 otherwise we'll move onto fmarier_ 's debian topic and try wrap up the meeting +21:29:40 lamiette_: soon i expect she'll be pushing patches to gerrit +21:29:55 and we'll see her name in the 1.5 credits +21:30:07 fmarier_: woot! +21:30:16 awesome :-) +21:30:57 right +21:31:00 #topic Invitation to join the Debian Packaging team +21:31:03 fmarier_: +21:31:08 (sorry I missed you before) +21:31:13 well, there's not much to add really :) +21:31:23 heh +21:31:30 and dobedobedoh and rkabalin_ have already responded to it +21:31:48 it was mostly a call for volunteers to expand the one-person packaging team :) +21:31:53 so what's the gist? +21:31:54 oh +21:31:56 me too +21:32:04 fmarier_: how much commitment do you need ;-) +21:32:09 It makes sense for us -- we use debian almost exclusively, and we package pretty much everything we write +21:32:10 fmarier_: 3 active members +21:32:12 :) +21:32:22 s/write/use/ +21:32:51 fmarier_: I think its interesting to compare to the Moodle package that you took under your wing +21:33:10 the package is only updated when there's a new mahara release, but security fixes need to be backported to all supported distros, so that requires a bit of testing +21:33:37 Is the Debian package used in ubuntu too? +21:33:44 yup +21:34:19 anyways, i'll talk to the new recruits and we'll sort something out :) +21:34:26 awesome +21:34:28 fmarier_: Cool :) +21:34:39 fmarier_: thanks +21:34:50 rkabalin_: dobedobedoh thanks for volunteering +21:35:02 i can probably help out as well +21:35:05 * dobedobedoh is excited to be a part of it +21:35:06 #info fmarier_ welcomes dobedobedoh and rkabalin_ to the Mahara packaging team +21:35:25 congrats +21:35:26 okay +21:35:28 next meeting +21:35:44 #topic Next Meeting date +21:36:04 I put a suggested time up of Thursday, 28 July 2011, 08:30:00 UTC +21:36:14 just cause it was a month away +21:36:32 #agree +21:36:35 if we make it the week of the 1 Aug, I might be able to make it +21:36:46 but I can't the week before +21:37:08 but that actually is wrong now cause of apparently us having summer over here or something (though it seems more wintery) +21:37:16 I was going to suggest that, for their own sanity, we have a chair who is working in their evening -- saves you getting up even earlier to prepare for an early meeting +21:37:27 fmarier_: yeah, incidentally I can't make the date I suggested as I'll be in Scotland :P +21:37:31 28th is not good as it is moodlemoot nz and i may not be back yet (as we are on in the evening) +21:37:43 alright, so 28th is out :) +21:37:52 so the following thursday? +21:37:53 how about 3 Aug? +21:37:58 week of the 1st of August? +21:38:14 works for me +21:38:19 3th is fine with me +21:38:30 fine with me +21:38:31 3rd august @ 19:30 NZST; 4th August @ 08:30 GMT Is that? +21:38:44 eh nope. rather the other way around ;-) +21:38:54 but as we are in the evening, it's morning the same day for you +21:38:58 dobedobedoh: stick to UTC dates only, it reduces the number of possible errors :) +21:39:02 http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730 +21:39:07 does that look right? +21:39:28 ye +21:39:30 #agreed +21:39:30 yep +21:39:35 #agreed +21:39:37 #agreed +21:39:43 #agreed +21:39:43 #agreed +21:39:44 #agreed +21:39:50 #agreed +21:39:57 #agreed +21:39:58 #agreed +21:40:02 #agreed +21:40:18 #link http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730 +21:40:47 who wants to chair next time? +21:41:10 I will volunteer (with a caveat) +21:41:25 I could give it a go, it's in my evening time +21:41:44 #info next meeting Wednesday, 3 August 2011, 07:30:00 UTC time +21:41:46 * dobedobedoh wonders what dan_p's caveat is! +21:42:20 caveat is that lamiette_ lets me insert an AOB into this meeting +21:42:20 dan_p: ? +21:43:05 AOB= any other business +21:43:06 *sigh* +21:43:09 if you must +21:43:40 I'd like to apologise for the poor availability of jenkins.mahara.org. Turns out the old server we put it on is in bad shape. Moving to our VM cluster and also less dependency on me in LUNS is in the pipeline, as well as more tests. +21:44:25 for now, if you can't get hold of me, support@luns.net.uk will help you ;-) +21:44:45 . +21:44:45 and i'd like to thank dan_p and LUNS for setting it up. it's really good to have and i really like how you added the link to the reports in the -1 comments :) +21:44:59 definitely +21:45:00 thanks dan_p +21:45:20 yep, thanks heaps dan_p, it's already been very useful +21:46:04 cool +21:46:05 right +21:46:12 nearing 11pm here +21:46:16 thanks to lamiette_ for chairing tonight +21:46:16 so I think meeting over +21:46:20 (poorly) +21:46:23 :) +21:46:24 thank you, lamiette_ +21:46:33 lamiette_: thanks +21:46:38 thank you lamiette_ +21:46:39 thx +21:46:41 thanks lamiette_ ! +21:46:43 thanks lamiette_ +21:46:47 thanks lamiette_ +21:46:47 we made it under 2.5 hours, lamiette_! :-) +21:46:59 anitsirk: yay! +21:47:06 thanks lamiette_ +21:47:08 ty lamiette_ ! :D +21:47:17 my very first +21:47:24 ;D +21:47:24 okay everyone ! Ka Kite +21:47:27 #endmeeting \ No newline at end of file diff --git a/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.txt b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.txt new file mode 100644 index 0000000000000000000000000000000000000000..3089d390857831ff2602f02d59e719e9e71948e5 --- /dev/null +++ b/public_html/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.txt @@ -0,0 +1,221 @@ +=================== +#mahara-dev Meeting +=================== + + +Meeting started by lamiette_ at 19:35:46 UTC. The full logs are +available at +http://meetbot.mahara.org/mahara-dev/2011/mahara-dev.2011-06-29-19.35.log.html +. + + + +Meeting summary +--------------- +* Meeting Attendees (lamiette_, 19:35:54) + * dobedobedoh is Andrew Nicols - LUNS Ltd, UK (dobedobedoh, 19:36:31) + * anitsirk is Kristina Hoeppner from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ + (anitsirk, 19:36:36) + * rkabalin_ is Ruslan Kabalin, LUNS Ltd., Lancaster, UK (rkabalin_, + 19:36:46) + * richardm is Richard Mansfield from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ + (richardm, 19:36:52) + * lamiette_ is Stacey Walker from Catalyst IT in Brighton UK + (lamiette_, 19:37:02) + * hughdavenport_ho is Hugh Davenport from Catalyst IT in Wellington, + NZ (hughdavenport_ho, 19:37:06) + * dan_p_ is Dan Poltawski, LUNS ltd uk (on train) (dan_p_, 19:37:24) + * thomaswbell88 is Thomas Bell from TDM Ltd, UK (thomaswbell88, + 19:37:28) + * is Francois Marier (fmarier_, 19:37:30) + * bugg_home is Brett Wilkinsa from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ + (bugg_home, 19:37:30) + * ricardomano is Richard Hand from TDM Ltd, UK (ricardomano, + 19:37:43) + * pxh is Piers Harding from Catalyst IT in Wellington, NZ (pxh, + 19:40:06) + +* MNet future -- We're adding Web Services to 1.5 (lamiette_, 19:43:31) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices + (fmarier_, 19:43:43) + * pxh has writtten a web services framework, based on the Moodle 2.0 + web services Further information at + https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Plugins/Artefact/WebServices + (lamiette_, 19:57:36) + * pxh> features are: SOAP, REST (really just basic HTTP post + parameters or JSON), and XML-RPC (lamiette_, 19:59:00) + * Auth via WSEE for SOAP, as well as the tokens/users (as mentioned + before) (lamiette_, 19:59:14) + * LINK: https://gitorious.org/mahara-contrib/artefact-webservice + (lamiette_, 20:02:38) + * available as a contrib plugin (lamiette_, 20:02:53) + * we have to start thinking about Mnet stuff: largely due to this from + Moodle HQ http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=175158 + (lamiette_, 20:06:14) + +* Bug status proposal (lamiette_, 20:06:58) + * milestones have been used for marking bugs to upcoming releases and + as for a changelog/detailed version of the release notes + (lamiette_, 20:12:12) + * ACTION: fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" + usage guidelines (lamiette_, 20:22:45) + * every new feature on master should have a bug report associated with + it (lamiette_, 20:25:18) + * reviewers to be stricter about suitable bug numbers for features + submitted to gerrit - isn't mandatory though (lamiette_, 20:32:02) + +* MaharaUK2011 (lamiette_, 20:32:31) + * LUNS and TDM have both offered to host maharauk, so we've suggested + that 12 is in Lancaster, hosted by LUNS and 13 is in the West + Midlands, hosted by TDM (lamiette_, 20:34:58) + * LINK: + http://cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/keysigning_party/en/keysigning_party.html + (fmarier_, 20:40:17) + * There was also talk about some entity hosting online 'conferences' + inbetween during the year (webinar type things) (lamiette_, + 20:40:55) + * twitter hashtag #maharauk11 for anyone interested in seeing what + attendees had to say (lamiette_, 20:42:20) + * LINK: http://t.co/dFHqjYX - Git in Mahara (dobedobedoh, 20:42:39) + * LINK: http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations - both my + presentations (rkabalin_, 20:43:00) + * LINK: http://www.slideshare.net/rkabalin/presentations (lamiette_, + 20:43:29) + * LINK: http://www.slideshare.net/andrewnicols/presentations for mine + (dobedobedoh, 20:44:10) + * LINK: + http://www.slideshare.net/4nitsirk/21-34-ways-to-get-involved-in-mahara + (anitsirk, 20:44:28) + * LINK: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rbz9vST0CLw recording + (anitsirk, 20:45:01) + * LINK: Mark Osbornes keynote + http://prezi.com/dubgzzefzioj/maharauk-open-for-learning/ + (lamiette_, 20:45:45) + +* Mahara Reviewer applications# (lamiette_, 20:46:05) + * Hugh Davenport Mahara reviewer application (lamiette_, 20:48:33) + * Brett Wilkins Mahara reviewer application (lamiette_, 20:48:49) + * Darryl Hamilton Mahara reviewer application (lamiette_, 20:49:26) + * lordp is Darryl Hamilton (lordp, 20:49:38) + * LINK: + http://meetbot.mahara.org/mahara-dev/2010/mahara-dev.2010-11-10-07.34.html + FYI (dobedobedoh, 20:51:39) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Code_Review + (lamiette_, 20:56:30) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Hughdavenport + (lamiette_, 20:56:40) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Brettwilkins + (fmarier_, 20:56:54) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/User:Darrylh (fmarier_, + 20:57:01) + * AGREED: Hugh Davenport to become Mahara reviewer (lamiette_, + 21:03:05) + * AGREED: Brett Wilkins to become a Mahara reviewer (lamiette_, + 21:09:26) + * AGREED: (lamiette_, 21:09:30) + +* mahara.org forum badges (lamiette_, 21:13:27) + * AGREED: (lamiette_, 21:21:05) + * ACTION: thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges + and post on the wiki under Specifications in Development + (lamiette_, 21:21:44) + * LINK: + https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Developer_Area/Specifications_in_Development + (lamiette_, 21:21:52) + +* Update on the user manual (lamiette_, 21:24:27) + * the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the repository contains + a Makefile for easy creation of the output file. (anitsirk, + 21:24:41) + * the manual sits in git, some information on where it is and how to + set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting in vim) is at + (anitsirk, 21:24:51) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup + (lamiette_, 21:24:52) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup + (anitsirk, 21:24:55) + * we now have another mahara family member: the Mahara Scribe thanks + to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on the wiki. :-) + (anitsirk, 21:25:07) + * the user manual is now started in asciidoc. the repository contains + a Makefile for easy creation of the output file. (anitsirk, + 21:25:44) + * the manual sits in git, some information on where it is and how to + set up asciidoc (esp. the syntax-highlighting in vim) is at + (anitsirk, 21:25:50) + * LINK: https://wiki.mahara.org/index.php/Manual/Manual_Setup + (anitsirk, 21:25:56) + * we now have another mahara family member: the Mahara Scribe thanks + to evonne who came up with it. it's now also on the wiki. :-) + (anitsirk, 21:26:02) + +* Invitation to join the Debian Packaging team (lamiette_, 21:31:00) + * fmarier_ welcomes dobedobedoh and rkabalin_ to the Mahara packaging + team (fmarier_, 21:35:06) + +* Next Meeting date (lamiette_, 21:35:44) + * LINK: + http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730 + (lamiette_, 21:39:02) + * AGREED: (lamiette_, 21:39:43) + * LINK: + http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20110803T0730 + (lamiette_, 21:40:18) + * next meeting Wednesday, 3 August 2011, 07:30:00 UTC time + (lamiette_, 21:41:44) + +Meeting ended at 21:47:27 UTC. + + + + +Action Items +------------ +* fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage + guidelines +* thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post on + the wiki under Specifications in Development + + + + +Action Items, by person +----------------------- +* fmarier_ + * fmarier_ to update the bug status page with new "milestone" usage + guidelines +* thomaswbell88 + * thomaswbell88 to come up with ideas for mahara.org badges and post + on the wiki under Specifications in Development +* **UNASSIGNED** + * (none) + + + + +People Present (lines said) +--------------------------- +* lamiette_ (186) +* fmarier_ (120) +* dobedobedoh (71) +* anitsirk (61) +* rkabalin_ (45) +* pxh (36) +* dan_p (34) +* bugg_home (33) +* richardm (29) +* thomaswbell88 (26) +* hughdavenport_ho (19) +* dan_p_ (11) +* Mjollnir` (9) +* lordp (3) +* waawaamilk (3) +* maharameet (3) +* ricardomano (1) + + + + +Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 + +.. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot