Commit f258d135 authored by Andrew Robert Nicols's avatar Andrew Robert Nicols

[mahara-dev] Meeting of 8th November 2011

Signed-off-by: default avatarAndrew Robert Nicols <>
parent cf82a8b9
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<meta http-equiv="Content-type" content="text/html;charset=UTF-8">
<title>#mahara-dev Meeting</title>
<style type="text/css">
/* This is for the .html in the HTML2 writer */
body {
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif;
h1 {
text-align: center;
a {
text-decoration: none;
border-bottom:1px dotted navy;
a:hover {
border-bottom: 0;
hr {
border: 1px solid #ccc;
/* The (nick, time) item pairs, and other body text things. */
.details {
font-size: 12px;
/* The 'AGREED:', 'IDEA', etc, prefix to lines. */
.itemtype {
font-style: normal; /* un-italics it */
font-weight: bold;
/* Example: change single item types. Capitalized command name.
/* .TOPIC { color:navy; } */
/* .AGREED { color:lime; } */
<h1>#mahara-dev Meeting</h1>
<span class="details">
Meeting started by richardm at 19:31:40 UTC
(<a href="mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html">full logs</a>).</span>
<h3>Meeting summary</h3>
<li><b class="TOPIC">Meeting attendees</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-4'>richardm</a>, 19:31:47)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><span class="INFO">richardm is Richard Mansfield, Catalyst,
NZ</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">dobedobedoh is Andrew Nicols - LUNS Ltd,
UK</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">hughdavenport is Hugh Davenport, Catalyst IT,
NZ</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">pxh is Piers Harding, Catalyst, NZ</span> <span
<li><span class="INFO">dan_p is Dan Poltawski - LUNS Ltd, UK</span>
<span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">rkabalin is Ruslan Kabalin, LUNS Ltd.,
UK</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">dajan is Dominique-Alain from
Switzerland</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">anzeljg is Gregor An�elj, developer and
translator</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">anitsirk is Kristina Hoeppner from Catalyst IT,
Wellington, NZ</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><b class="TOPIC">Items from previous meeting</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-16'>richardm</a>, 19:33:12)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><span class="INFO">dan_p LUNS to investigate adding a new mahara
integration project to run selenium tests</span> <span
<li><span class="INFO">dobedobedoh to look at modifying release &amp;
test running scripts to look for tests in the right places</span>
<span class="details">(<a
<li><i class="itemtype">ACTION</i>: <span class="ACTION">dobedobedoh
to create a bug for modifying release &amp; test running scripts to
look for tests in the right places</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><b class="TOPIC">Starting the discussion about a possible date / month for the Mahara 1.5 release (Kristina)</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-62'>richardm</a>, 19:42:12)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><i class="itemtype">IDEA</i>: <span class="IDEA">I just wanted to
start the discussion about the release date as we are getting close
to the end of 2011 and more and more people ask about Mahara 1.5 and
soon will ask about when it's going to be released. As most of our
user base is in the northern hemisphere, I'd like to see a release
date in late spring so that the edu sector can upgrade over the
northern hemispheric summer as that seems to be the best and for
many only time to upgra</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">votes for freeze dates: Dec: 3, Jan: 3, Feb: 1,
Mar: 3, Apr: 2</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><b class="TOPIC">Handling security issues (Francois)</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-159'>richardm</a>, 20:06:18)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><span class="INFO">click the security checkbox when reporting a
security issue on the tracker</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">patches should go as attachments on that
private bug instead of gerrit</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">don't discuss it on IRC, the forums, etc. just
email</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><i class="itemtype">ACTION</i>: <span class="ACTION">dobedobedoh
to look at the possibility of adding a hook to the Makefile to
reject patches with security bugs in the subject</span> <span
<li><b class="TOPIC">Future possibilities for flexible page designs - layouts and themes (Mike Kelly)</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-189'>richardm</a>, 20:13:57)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><span class="INFO">waawaamilk reckons we should go for absolute
positioning for all objects, it's the way of the future</span> <span
<span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">mikekelly_ will put together a test instance
with rows in views, or absolute positioning of all blocks, if he
gets time</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">anzeljg is extending custom skins with Google
Web Fonts</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">everyone wants more flexible page layouts in
mahara!</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><b class="TOPIC">Request for development docs (Dajan)</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-293'>richardm</a>, 20:39:26)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><span class="INFO">it would be useful to have up to date docs to
talk to conference participants, but current info is unstructured
&amp; difficult to assemble</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><i class="itemtype">IDEA</i>: <span class="IDEA">by fmarier_ :
link to a list of upcoming features (constantly updated release
notes) in the quarterly newsletter to keep community informed about
these</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">we'll try tagging all bugs that should go in
the release notes</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">dajan to start adding feature tags to bugs in
the 1.5 milestone</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">everyone to start adding feature tags when
setting bugs to fix committed (when it's a feature)</span> <span
<li><i class="itemtype">ACTION</i>: <span class="ACTION">dajan to
report on tagging existing 1.5 features on the tracker</span> <span
<li><b class="TOPIC">Next meeting and chair</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-396'>richardm</a>, 21:06:53)</span>
<ol type="a">
<li><i class="itemtype">IDEA</i>: <span class="IDEA">Wednesday 7th
December @ 07:30 UTC (07:30 GMT/20:30 NZDT)</span> <span
<span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">hugh_home to chair the next meeting</span>
<span class="details">(<a
<li><i class="itemtype">IDEA</i>: <span class="IDEA">Tuesday 6th
December @ 07:30 UTC (07:30 GMT/20:30 NZDT)</span> <span
<span class="details">(<a
<li><span class="INFO">next meeting will be Tuesday 6th December @
07:30 UTC, chaired by hugh_home</span> <span class="details">(<a
<li><b class="TOPIC">Any other business</b> <span class="details">(<a href='mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html#l-437'>richardm</a>, 21:12:01)</span>
<span class="details">
Meeting ended at 21:18:13 UTC
(<a href="mahara-dev.2011-11-08-19.31.log.html">full logs</a>).</span>
<h3>Action items</h3>
<li>dobedobedoh to create a bug for modifying release &amp; test running scripts to look for tests in the right places</li>
<li>dobedobedoh to look at the possibility of adding a hook to the Makefile to reject patches with security bugs in the subject</li>
<li>dajan to report on tagging existing 1.5 features on the tracker</li>
<h3>Action items, by person</h3>
<li> dajan <ol>
<li>dajan to report on tagging existing 1.5 features on the tracker</li>
<li> dobedobedoh <ol>
<li>dobedobedoh to create a bug for modifying release &amp; test running scripts to look for tests in the right places</li>
<li>dobedobedoh to look at the possibility of adding a hook to the Makefile to reject patches with security bugs in the subject</li>
<h3>People present (lines said)</h3>
<li>richardm (108)</li>
<li>fmarier_ (83)</li>
<li>anitsirk (50)</li>
<li>dajan (46)</li>
<li>dobedobedoh (28)</li>
<li>hugh_home (27)</li>
<li>mikekelly_ (26)</li>
<li>waawaamilk (25)</li>
<li>dan_p (19)</li>
<li>pxh (13)</li>
<li>anzeljg (12)</li>
<li>rkabalin_ (8)</li>
<li>_anzeljg_ (7)</li>
<li>maharameet (6)</li>
<li>alberto (4)</li>
<li>elky (1)</li>
<span class="details">Generated by <a href="">MeetBot</a> 0.1.4.</span>
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<meta http-equiv="Content-type" content="text/html;charset=UTF-8">
<title>#mahara-dev log</title>
<style type="text/css">
/* For the .log.html */
pre { /*line-height: 125%;*/
white-space: pre-wrap; }
body { background: #f0f0f0; }
body .tm { color: #007020 } /* time */
body .nk { color: #062873; font-weight: bold } /* nick, regular */
body .nka { color: #007020; font-weight: bold } /* action nick */
body .ac { color: #00A000 } /* action line */
body .hi { color: #4070a0 } /* hilights */
/* Things to make particular MeetBot commands stick out */
body .topic { color: #007020; font-weight: bold }
body .topicline { color: #000080; font-weight: bold }
body .cmd { color: #007020; font-weight: bold }
body .cmdline { font-weight: bold }
<pre><a name="l-1"></a><span class="tm">19:31:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#startmeeting</span><span class="cmdline"></span>
<a name="l-2"></a><span class="tm">19:31:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;maharameet&gt;</span> Meeting started Tue Nov 8 19:31:40 2011 UTC. The chair is richardm. Information about MeetBot at
<a name="l-3"></a><span class="tm">19:31:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;maharameet&gt;</span> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
<a name="l-4"></a><span class="tm">19:31:47</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="topic">#topic </span><span class="topicline">Meeting attendees</span>
<a name="l-5"></a><span class="tm">19:31:52</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> Please put #info in front of your name
<a name="l-6"></a><span class="tm">19:31:55</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">richardm is Richard Mansfield, Catalyst, NZ</span>
<a name="l-7"></a><span class="tm">19:32:09</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">dobedobedoh is Andrew Nicols - LUNS Ltd, UK</span>
<a name="l-8"></a><span class="tm">19:32:11</span><span class="nk"> &lt;hugh_home&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">hughdavenport is Hugh Davenport, Catalyst IT, NZ</span>
<a name="l-9"></a><span class="tm">19:32:12</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">pxh is Piers Harding, Catalyst, NZ</span>
<a name="l-10"></a><span class="tm">19:32:15</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">dan_p is Dan Poltawski - LUNS Ltd, UK</span>
<a name="l-11"></a><span class="tm">19:32:17</span><span class="nk"> &lt;rkabalin_&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">rkabalin is Ruslan Kabalin, LUNS Ltd., UK</span>
<a name="l-12"></a><span class="tm">19:32:20</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">dajan is Dominique-Alain from Switzerland</span>
<a name="l-13"></a><span class="tm">19:32:24</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">anzeljg is Gregor An�elj, developer and translator</span>
<a name="l-14"></a><span class="tm">19:32:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">anitsirk is Kristina Hoeppner from Catalyst IT, Wellington, NZ</span>
<a name="l-15"></a><span class="tm">19:33:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> cool, good crowd, hopefully others will show up soon
<a name="l-16"></a><span class="tm">19:33:12</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="topic">#topic </span><span class="topicline">Items from previous meeting</span>
<a name="l-17"></a><span class="tm">19:33:22</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">dan_p LUNS to investigate adding a new mahara integration project to run selenium tests</span>
<a name="l-18"></a><span class="tm">19:33:29</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dan_p:</span> over to you!
<a name="l-19"></a><span class="tm">19:34:10</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> I'm afraid I still haven't done it
<a name="l-20"></a><span class="tm">19:34:47</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ok, should we move it to the current tasks wiki page?
<a name="l-21"></a><span class="tm">19:35:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> is it not there already?
<a name="l-22"></a><span class="tm">19:35:17</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ah, maybe, I didn't check actually
<a name="l-23"></a><span class="tm">19:35:25</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> I'm also leaving LUNS in January, so will need to see if rkabalin or dobe want to do it
<a name="l-24"></a><span class="tm">19:35:42</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ah I see
<a name="l-25"></a><span class="tm">19:35:43</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> Or agree to move it back to tasks ;)
<a name="l-26"></a><span class="tm">19:35:56</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dan_p:</span> are you leaving mahara as well as luns?
<a name="l-27"></a><span class="tm">19:36:21</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> i guess that makes sense (moving it back to tasks). anybody is free to pick it back up if they want
<a name="l-28"></a><span class="tm">19:36:43</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> <span class="hi">richardm:</span> I hope not
<a name="l-29"></a><span class="tm">19:36:54</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> :-)
<a name="l-30"></a><span class="tm">19:37:00</span><span class="nk"> &lt;rkabalin_&gt;</span> I may take that task over
<a name="l-31"></a><span class="tm">19:37:01</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> I am going to moodle hq
<a name="l-32"></a><span class="tm">19:37:10</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dan_p:</span> cool!
<a name="l-33"></a><span class="tm">19:37:12</span><span class="nk"> &lt;hugh_home&gt;</span> nice
<a name="l-34"></a><span class="tm">19:37:15</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> are you then also moving down under?
<a name="l-35"></a><span class="tm">19:37:18</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> are you moving to Perth?
<a name="l-36"></a><span class="tm">19:37:21</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> So will hope to stay involved
<a name="l-37"></a><span class="tm">19:37:21</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dan_p:</span> congrats
<a name="l-38"></a><span class="tm">19:37:27</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> Yes
<a name="l-39"></a><span class="tm">19:37:32</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> cool.
<a name="l-40"></a><span class="tm">19:37:38</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> wow, that'll be a big change
<a name="l-41"></a><span class="tm">19:37:51</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> (also I'm typing on an iPad, sorry!)
<a name="l-42"></a><span class="tm">19:37:52</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dan_p:</span> congratulations
<a name="l-43"></a><span class="tm">19:38:13</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> awesome
<a name="l-44"></a><span class="tm">19:38:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> lucky guy, working in Aus. Perth is not as bad as that. You will see
<a name="l-45"></a><span class="tm">19:38:52</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#action </span><span class="cmdline">richardm to move the new mahara integration project back to tasks if it's not already there</span>
<a name="l-46"></a><span class="tm">19:39:02</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> Thanks everyone :)
<a name="l-47"></a><span class="tm">19:39:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">richardm:</span> you can take it out, i've already done it :)
<a name="l-48"></a><span class="tm">19:39:11</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#undo</span><span class="cmdline"></span>
<a name="l-49"></a><span class="tm">19:39:11</span><span class="nk"> &lt;maharameet&gt;</span> Removing item from minutes: &lt;MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x987fe6c&gt;
<a name="l-50"></a><span class="tm">19:39:21</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> cool
<a name="l-51"></a><span class="tm">19:39:38</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> alright, next item
<a name="l-52"></a><span class="tm">19:39:39</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">dobedobedoh to look at modifying release &amp; test running scripts to look for tests in the right places</span>
<a name="l-53"></a><span class="tm">19:39:57</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> make it a topic, richardm then it shows up as such
<a name="l-54"></a><span class="tm">19:40:09</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ah ok
<a name="l-55"></a><span class="tm">19:40:10</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> sorry.
<a name="l-56"></a><span class="tm">19:40:15</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Sadly I haven't had a chance to work on that yet. I was hoping to chat to elky or fmarier as to which scripts need updating
<a name="l-57"></a><span class="tm">19:41:07</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> do we have a bug on the tracker to keep track of that? (that seems to be the more logical place to keep this item)
<a name="l-58"></a><span class="tm">19:41:16</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Not yet
<a name="l-59"></a><span class="tm">19:41:18</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> I'll create one
<a name="l-60"></a><span class="tm">19:41:23</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ok
<a name="l-61"></a><span class="tm">19:41:47</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#action </span><span class="cmdline">dobedobedoh to create a bug for modifying release &amp; test running scripts to look for tests in the right places</span>
<a name="l-62"></a><span class="tm">19:42:12</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="topic">#topic </span><span class="topicline">Starting the discussion about a possible date / month for the Mahara 1.5 release (Kristina)</span>
<a name="l-63"></a><span class="tm">19:42:25</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#idea </span><span class="cmdline">I just wanted to start the discussion about the release date as we are getting close to the end of 2011 and more and more people ask about Mahara 1.5 and soon will ask about when it's going to be released. As most of our user base is in the northern hemisphere, I'd like to see a release date in late spring so that the edu sector can upgrade over the northern hemispheric summer as that seems to be the best and for many only time to upgra</span>
<a name="l-64"></a><span class="tm">19:42:30</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> ..
<a name="l-65"></a><span class="tm">19:43:18</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> so our current objective i think is to have releases every 6 to 12 months
<a name="l-66"></a><span class="tm">19:43:37</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> which would mean 1.5 at the earliest in December and at the latest in June
<a name="l-67"></a><span class="tm">19:44:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> December isn't too realistic
<a name="l-68"></a><span class="tm">19:44:08</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> and based on previous releases, we should probably plan to freeze about 2 months before we want to release
<a name="l-69"></a><span class="tm">19:44:17</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> i think a release in june is more feasible because then we can still put some more features into it because most will not update before that i think.
<a name="l-70"></a><span class="tm">19:44:30</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> skin support?
<a name="l-71"></a><span class="tm">19:44:35</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> so yeah, richard is right, the earliest would be February (if we were to freeze now)
<a name="l-72"></a><span class="tm">19:46:18</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> personally, i don't really have a strong opinion
<a name="l-73"></a><span class="tm">19:46:29</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> i would think a freeze in april like this year would be quite good as this gives us a bit more time for planning and finishing up work
<a name="l-74"></a><span class="tm">19:46:37</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> i'm not sure we should always base releases on when school terms start
<a name="l-75"></a><span class="tm">19:46:38</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> but it looks like there are a few features that would be nice to have
<a name="l-76"></a><span class="tm">19:46:50</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> if we do that, we're always committing to 12 months
<a name="l-77"></a><span class="tm">19:47:36</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> do you want to release more frequently?
<a name="l-78"></a><span class="tm">19:47:53</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> I would like to get web services - if possible
<a name="l-79"></a><span class="tm">19:48:01</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> the last two have been more like 9 months, right? and we already have enough in master for a good release now if we were so inclined
<a name="l-80"></a><span class="tm">19:48:04</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> in - that is
<a name="l-81"></a><span class="tm">19:48:27</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">anitsirk:</span> we want to retain the flexibility to adjust the release date I think
<a name="l-82"></a><span class="tm">19:49:11</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> sure, but if we release now / soon then people will still only upgrade in july / august and miss the features we're putting into 1.6 between the release and then.
<a name="l-83"></a><span class="tm">19:49:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> As a technician and according with what I see as consultant, just delivering a new release before the end/beginning of term is not ideal. People need times to install the new release test it, see how much work they have to plan for the update and then the training of their users/teachers. Having a new release, let say a couple of months before the end of term seems more reasonable to me.
<a name="l-84"></a><span class="tm">19:49:29</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> If we're not moving to a time-based release strategy, what are our criteria for release?
<a name="l-85"></a><span class="tm">19:50:11</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dobedobedoh:</span> basically the way we've done it is that we decide to freeze when we have the features we want
<a name="l-86"></a><span class="tm">19:50:16</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> more or less
<a name="l-87"></a><span class="tm">19:50:27</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> Do you have the features now?
<a name="l-88"></a><span class="tm">19:50:37</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> but of course, we can always decide to push some to the next release
<a name="l-89"></a><span class="tm">19:50:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Where's the list of features?
<a name="l-90"></a><span class="tm">19:50:42</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> we also need a window when there's not too much other work on
<a name="l-91"></a><span class="tm">19:51:10</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> christmas/new year is good for that
<a name="l-92"></a><span class="tm">19:51:57</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">pxh:</span> yes, usually. but last new year that didn't work out too well :)
<a name="l-93"></a><span class="tm">19:52:34</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dobedobedoh:</span> the list of features is in the git logs :)
<a name="l-94"></a><span class="tm">19:52:53</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> and on the 1.5.0 milestone on the tracker
<a name="l-95"></a><span class="tm">19:53:38</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> As dajan has said, its a mixed bag releasing too close to the term start/end anyway
<a name="l-96"></a><span class="tm">19:54:22</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> I guess we don't have to decide today, but would it be fair to say that the freeze will happen sometime between Feb and Apr?
<a name="l-97"></a><span class="tm">19:54:24</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> so if there is enough for a release i'd say release ;-)
<a name="l-98"></a><span class="tm">19:54:38</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> freeze even
<a name="l-99"></a><span class="tm">19:55:06</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> ditto
<a name="l-100"></a><span class="tm">19:55:07</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> but in a way i don't think amking it too random is good because then people can't really plan
<a name="l-101"></a><span class="tm">19:55:10</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dan_p:</span> that's my opinion too, but i'm not really too worried
<a name="l-102"></a><span class="tm">19:56:01</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">anitsirk:</span> that's an argument for time-based releases but nobody was really keen last time we discussed that as far as I recall
<a name="l-103"></a><span class="tm">19:56:02</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">anitsirk:</span> well, they shouldn't rely too much on our plans anyway. we've certainly disappointed in the past
<a name="l-104"></a><span class="tm">19:56:33</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> I would have thought it was more healthy for a project to release frequently - it gives it a sense of life
<a name="l-105"></a><span class="tm">19:56:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> then we can only do better :-)
<a name="l-106"></a><span class="tm">19:56:44</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> <span class="hi">pxh:</span> agreed, that was my thought
<a name="l-107"></a><span class="tm">19:56:45</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Fair few bugs targetted for 1.5 not yet committed:
<a name="l-108"></a><span class="tm">19:56:47</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">pxh:</span> i agree
<a name="l-109"></a><span class="tm">19:57:52</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> ok, so quick poll: what month do you think we should freeze? (Dec, Jan, Feb, Mar, Apr)
<a name="l-110"></a><span class="tm">19:58:17</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Dec/Jan get my vote
<a name="l-111"></a><span class="tm">19:58:20</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> march / april
<a name="l-112"></a><span class="tm">19:58:23</span><span class="nk"> &lt;rkabalin_&gt;</span> I vote for Apr
<a name="l-113"></a><span class="tm">19:58:26 </span><span class="nka">* richardm</span> <span class="ac">votes to decide later</span>
<a name="l-114"></a><span class="tm">19:58:28</span><span class="nk"> &lt;hugh_home&gt;</span> dec/jan
<a name="l-115"></a><span class="tm">19:58:28</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> i would like to see skin support in - so i'd say mar
<a name="l-116"></a><span class="tm">19:58:31</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> Feb/March
<a name="l-117"></a><span class="tm">19:58:47</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> I'd like to get web services in if possible - the restructuring for core has been done but it needs to go through the acceptance process
<a name="l-118"></a><span class="tm">19:58:57</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dan_p&gt;</span> jan
<a name="l-119"></a><span class="tm">19:58:58</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> if that were possible then dec/jan
<a name="l-120"></a><span class="tm">19:59:24</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> Meaning that from Freeze to Release we must count about 2-3 months for beta testing and stabilization?
<a name="l-121"></a><span class="tm">19:59:25</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> I think Jan is good for those of us involved in Moodle - gives us 1 month after their release for things to calm down first
<a name="l-122"></a><span class="tm">19:59:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">pxh:</span> i think you might want to vote for a later month then :)
<a name="l-123"></a><span class="tm">19:59:55</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dajan:</span> approximately. it depends on what bugs we find in the frozen release branch
<a name="l-124"></a><span class="tm">20:00:11</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> <span class="hi">fmarier_:</span> the longer I wait the longer I have to maintain two versions ...
<a name="l-125"></a><span class="tm">20:00:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> true
<a name="l-126"></a><span class="tm">20:00:42</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> In Europe is think it is important institutions can play with a final release on May the later
<a name="l-127"></a><span class="tm">20:01:14</span><span class="nk"> &lt;alberto&gt;</span> hi
<a name="l-128"></a><span class="tm">20:01:23</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> hi
<a name="l-129"></a><span class="tm">20:01:24</span><span class="nk"> &lt;alberto&gt;</span> any people?
<a name="l-130"></a><span class="tm">20:01:25</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">quick dodgy poll results for opinions on freeze date: dec/jan 4, feb/mar/april 3,</span>
<a name="l-131"></a><span class="tm">20:01:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;hugh_home&gt;</span> hi alberto
<a name="l-132"></a><span class="tm">20:01:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;pxh&gt;</span> hi
<a name="l-133"></a><span class="tm">20:01:28</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> or wether the later they will skip a release to the next one. My opinion.
<a name="l-134"></a><span class="tm">20:02:09</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> feb/mar/apr 4 - my count
<a name="l-135"></a><span class="tm">20:02:24</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#undo</span><span class="cmdline"></span>
<a name="l-136"></a><span class="tm">20:02:24</span><span class="nk"> &lt;maharameet&gt;</span> Removing item from minutes: &lt;MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x98937ec&gt;
<a name="l-137"></a><span class="tm">20:02:27</span><span class="nk"> &lt;alberto&gt;</span> i am working in customizing mahara, and i like to show only friends in the invite group form, can anybody help me?
<a name="l-138"></a><span class="tm">20:02:30</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">quick dodgy poll results for opinions on freeze date: dec/jan 4, feb/mar/april 4</span>
<a name="l-139"></a><span class="tm">20:02:50</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> and i've got: Dec: 3, Jan: 3, Feb: 1, Mar: 3, Apr: 2
<a name="l-140"></a><span class="tm">20:03:19</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ok that's better
<a name="l-141"></a><span class="tm">20:03:23</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#undo</span><span class="cmdline"></span>
<a name="l-142"></a><span class="tm">20:03:23</span><span class="nk"> &lt;maharameet&gt;</span> Removing item from minutes: &lt;MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x989354c&gt;
<a name="l-143"></a><span class="tm">20:03:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> No pool tools in IRC :-)
<a name="l-144"></a><span class="tm">20:03:32</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> too bad, dajan
<a name="l-145"></a><span class="tm">20:03:45</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">votes for freeze dates: Dec: 3, Jan: 3, Feb: 1, Mar: 3, Apr: 2</span>
<a name="l-146"></a><span class="tm">20:03:50</span><span class="nk"> &lt;alberto&gt;</span> i am late, but there is a log of this chat?
<a name="l-147"></a><span class="tm">20:03:54</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> i guess, we'll have to update the meeting host guide to include a link to an easy poll ;-)
<a name="l-148"></a><span class="tm">20:03:59</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> <span class="hi">alberto:</span>
<a name="l-149"></a><span class="tm">20:04:00</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> alberto, you've dropped in the middle of the meeting. please stay to the end or ask that question in the forum...
<a name="l-150"></a><span class="tm">20:04:02</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">alberto:</span> there will be at the end of the meeting
<a name="l-151"></a><span class="tm">20:04:34</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ok, shall we move on?
<a name="l-152"></a><span class="tm">20:04:43</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> just a sec please
<a name="l-153"></a><span class="tm">20:05:12</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> so to summarize: if somebody asks in a presentation etc., i could say that 1.5 will be released in the first half of 2012, right?
<a name="l-154"></a><span class="tm">20:05:36</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> (without mentioning any concrete month)
<a name="l-155"></a><span class="tm">20:05:41</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> s/will be released/is targeted/
<a name="l-156"></a><span class="tm">20:05:55</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="hi">anitsirk:</span> i think that's highly likely, but yes, it's always good to promise nothing
<a name="l-157"></a><span class="tm">20:05:59</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> we don't promise a release date, we promise a freeze date (once we have one)
<a name="l-158"></a><span class="tm">20:06:06</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> sounds good, fmarier_ thanks
<a name="l-159"></a><span class="tm">20:06:18</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="topic">#topic </span><span class="topicline">Handling security issues (Francois)</span>
<a name="l-160"></a><span class="tm">20:06:31</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> right, that's going to be a quick one
<a name="l-161"></a><span class="tm">20:06:52</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> but it's basically just a reminder that the process for filing security bugs is slightly different from normal ones
<a name="l-162"></a><span class="tm">20:07:09</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> you can put them on the tracker if you click the "this bug is a security bug" checkbox
<a name="l-163"></a><span class="tm">20:07:17</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> and it will be hidden from the public
<a name="l-164"></a><span class="tm">20:07:34</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> but if you are working on fixing it, patches should go as attachments on that private bug instead of gerrit
<a name="l-165"></a><span class="tm">20:07:46</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> we review the patches manually on the tracker
<a name="l-166"></a><span class="tm">20:07:59</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> and they get pulled in by the release script when we release
<a name="l-167"></a><span class="tm">20:08:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">click the security checkbox when reporting a security issue on the tracker</span>
<a name="l-168"></a><span class="tm">20:08:15</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">patches should go as attachments on that private bug instead of gerrit</span>
<a name="l-169"></a><span class="tm">20:08:30</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> if you're unsure about what to do with it, don't discuss it on IRC, the forums, etc. just email
<a name="l-170"></a><span class="tm">20:08:41</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> ..
<a name="l-171"></a><span class="tm">20:08:55</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#info </span><span class="cmdline">don't discuss it on IRC, the forums, etc. just email</span>
<a name="l-172"></a><span class="tm">20:09:15</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> that lack of initial transparency is there because sometimes it takes a while to fix an issue
<a name="l-173"></a><span class="tm">20:09:35</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> for example if we have to go through the entire codebase to make sure that the same problem doesn't exist elsewhere
<a name="l-174"></a><span class="tm">20:09:39</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> ..
<a name="l-175"></a><span class="tm">20:10:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;rkabalin_&gt;</span> and be careful with make push
<a name="l-176"></a><span class="tm">20:10:32</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Is there any benefit to adding a hook to the Makefile to reject patches with security bugs in the subject without being from a member of the security team?
<a name="l-177"></a><span class="tm">20:10:56</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> <span class="hi">dobedobedoh:</span> if you can think of a good way to do this, sure
<a name="l-178"></a><span class="tm">20:11:03</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> I'll have a ponder
<a name="l-179"></a><span class="tm">20:11:05</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> but i guess it's hard to get that from the commit message
<a name="l-180"></a><span class="tm">20:11:15</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> unless there's a CVE number in there
<a name="l-181"></a><span class="tm">20:11:26</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> but we usually get CVE numbers pretty late in the process
<a name="l-182"></a><span class="tm">20:11:27</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> ..
<a name="l-183"></a><span class="tm">20:11:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> But most commits include a bug number at some point within them
<a name="l-184"></a><span class="tm">20:12:28</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dobedobedoh&gt;</span> Anyhoo, I'll volunteer to have a go at playing with the Makefile
<a name="l-185"></a><span class="tm">20:12:42</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> ok, cool
<a name="l-186"></a><span class="tm">20:13:08</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="cmd">#action </span><span class="cmdline">dobedobedoh to look at the possibility of adding a hook to the Makefile to reject patches with security bugs in the subject</span>
<a name="l-187"></a><span class="tm">20:13:27</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> any more on this topic?
<a name="l-188"></a><span class="tm">20:13:51</span><span class="nk"> &lt;fmarier_&gt;</span> not from me
<a name="l-189"></a><span class="tm">20:13:57</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> <span class="topic">#topic </span><span class="topicline">Future possibilities for flexible page designs - layouts and themes (Mike Kelly)</span>
<a name="l-190"></a><span class="tm">20:14:04</span><span class="nk"> &lt;mikekelly_&gt;</span> Hi all
<a name="l-191"></a><span class="tm">20:14:09</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anzeljg&gt;</span> hi mike
<a name="l-192"></a><span class="tm">20:14:12</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> hi mikekelly_
<a name="l-193"></a><span class="tm">20:14:13</span><span class="nk"> &lt;dajan&gt;</span> hi
<a name="l-194"></a><span class="tm">20:14:22</span><span class="nk"> &lt;hugh_home&gt;</span> hey
<a name="l-195"></a><span class="tm">20:14:25</span><span class="nk"> &lt;mikekelly_&gt;</span> I hope this is the right forum to discuss this!
<a name="l-196"></a><span class="tm">20:14:25</span><span class="nk"> &lt;anitsirk&gt;</span> hi mikekelly_
<a name="l-197"></a><span class="tm">20:14:40</span><span class="nk"> &lt;richardm&gt;</span> sure